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Vhailor's Helm - cheesiest item ever?

Discussion in 'BG2: Throne of Bhaal (Classic)' started by MrMermaid, Feb 9, 2012.

  1. MrMermaid

    MrMermaid Reality is merely an illusion, albeit persistent Resourceful

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    I'm currently soloing a cleric/mage and have just completed the Planar Prison quest (freeing Haer, Raelis and co.) - went to the Mart, sold all my loot, and bought Vhailor's Helm from Deidre. It's just about the most ridiculous thing I've ever used, particularly with the UB mod installed, as I kept hold of the genie's flask from the expanded Kalah quest, and I can now, at will (every 8 hours) raise my reputation by 1 (by bringing Kalah back from the dead, over and over again), or just use the thing as a standard limited wish spell. Can't believe how nuts this thing is! (Shapechange Mindflayer or Iron golem anybody??) Any other stories anyone wants to share about this utterly stinky, cheesy item?
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2012
  2. Paracelsi

    Paracelsi ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    It's not as powerful in the unmodded game, though that doesn't make it any less cheesy when you do get to around end game SoA. Unless perhaps you're a single class mage, in which case you can simply cast the Simulacrum spell yourself. Then you can spam item/wand charges, use Protection from Magic scrolls on annoying spellcasters, spam powerful consumables like potions and Wish scrolls right before a major battle, etc.

    The most cheesy item in the game is still the Robe of Vecna imo. Vhailor's Helm and Carsomyr +6 are probably tied at second. Third would be Protection from Magic and Protection for Undead Scrolls, and 4th/5th would be a tossup between Wish scrolls/Simulacrum and Project Image scrolls/Cloak of Mirroring/Daystar (killing archliches at level 8 has never been easier)/unmodded Illithid Mind Circlets (these would rank higher if they didn't also bug the target) and a few other items I can't remember right now.

    I think the cheesiest item not found in-game is a Nahal's Reckless Dweomer scroll.
     
  3. dmc

    dmc Speak softly and carry a big briefcase Staff Member Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!)

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    Shield of Balduran is way up there in cheddar.
     
  4. SlickRCBD Gems: 24/31
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    What about the Staff of the Magi? Granted, you really have to earn it, but it is one of the most overpowered items in the game. The only way it would be worse is if it let a mage/thief backstab with it. Given everything else it does, I'm surprised it doesn't have a +4 or better enchantment to hit on it, but it's only +1.

    Think about what it does.
    Invisibility at will, lets you evade spells even if the mage has True Sight up and running. Not to mention being able to cast spell trap, and it does a free dispell magic upon hitting an enemy. Made easier by the -4 bonus to THAC0 from being invisible. The fireball/lightning spell sequencer is just icing on the cake.

    For those that forgot, here is the official description, courtesy of Dan Simpson's Item FAQ.

     
  5. Yoshimo's Heart Gems: 13/31
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    Pulse ammo is fairly cheesy (though extremely late game). Sets attacks to 5 and gives crazy attack bonuses and nice damage. They are brutal no matter what class has them.
     
  6. henkie

    henkie Hammertime Resourceful Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!)

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    You're talking about an item that's cheesy in combination with another item? There's a lot of items that are a lot more cheesy without needing any other item. Robe of Vecna just breaks the game, the cloak of mirroring is a permanent spell turning that can return any damage spell right back to the caster.

    Plus, as a C/M you can just cast project image or simulacrum yourself and you have the same effect as you get with Vhailor's Helm. Multiple times per day too.
     
  7. Blades of Vanatar

    Blades of Vanatar Vanatar will rise again Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Any weapon that can be used in the off-hand but add it's bonus to the main-hand attacks is cheese-city. Or bad engine-building.
     
  8. Splunge

    Splunge Bhaal’s financial advisor Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Any item or spell that allows you to directly or indirectly damage enemies is cheesy, as is any item or spell that allows you to directly or indirectly avoid or reduce damage taken from enemy attacks.
     
  9. T2Bruno

    T2Bruno The only source of knowledge is experience Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    ... such as weapons and armor. Ultimate cheese.

    Adventure naked!

    Now ... where's Viconia....
     
  10. Montresor

    Montresor Mostly Harmless Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder

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    Wouldn't it be cheesy to have Viccy run around naked and distracting the enemy?
     
  11. Marceror

    Marceror Chaos Shall Be Sown In Their Footsteps Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    Err, no, that would be sleazy rather than cheesy! ;)
     
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    Besides, I thought she was a Priestess of Shar, not Eilistraee.
     
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    By default yes that is true.
     
  14. Aldeth the Foppish Idiot

    Aldeth the Foppish Idiot Armed with My Mallet O' Thinking Veteran

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    Well, if it bother you, you can just complete the quest as intended and have the lamp disappear. I myself tend to avoid uber-cheese items.

    That would take my vote as well - complete protection from beholders. It's even worse than the cloak of mirroring, as the cloak doesn't protect you from ALL beholder rays - you can still be stunned for example - it's just the direct damage ones that you avoid like the spamming of cause serious wounds.

    Yes, but it hit as a +5 weapon, so it's not going to be a hindrance in combat - I personally like it best for fighter/mage multi or dual classes.

    I would just like to point out that Robe of Vecna only becomes a game breaker once you get Improved Alacrity. Time Stop, along with Improved Alacrity while wearing a Robe of Vecna pretty much allows you to empty your spell book on a target.
     
  15. henkie

    henkie Hammertime Resourceful Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!)

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    You're right, its true power is in combination with improved alacrity. Still Vhailor's Helm is much less cheesy than the robe because Vhailor's helm gives you something that every mage can have access to, while the robe imparts a bonus that can't be gotten in any other way.
     
  16. T2Bruno

    T2Bruno The only source of knowledge is experience Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Combining the Robe of Vecna and the Amulet of Power pretty much lets any mage, sorcerer, or cleric/thief (:)) get the first attack in. They're awesome in a solo game.

    It's too bad they didn't put the Eye of Vecna and Hand of Vecna in the game as well -- such artifacts would have been worthy of a soon-to-be-god. They could have thrown in a quest for the Head of Vecna as well.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2012
  17. Proteus_za

    Proteus_za

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    As much as the Shield is cheap... so are beholders! Or at least, without it, I find beholders extremely difficult to kill, much more so than Illithid.

    Why? Because you buff yourself up with all the spells you have, charge in - and they promptly use their anti magic ray and then disintegrate/imprisonment on you. What tactics can you use against them? They tend to all follow if you try to draw one out, and its only if you can surround one or two that they die quickly. But they can still disintegrate a party member and force a reload.

    I think their anti magic ability is the most powerful. I hesitate to use the word unbalanced, but I feel it is. Doesnt matter if I cast protection from petrification, or Chaotic Commands, one anti magic ray leaves me completely helpless.
     
  18. Montresor

    Montresor Mostly Harmless Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder

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    Tell me about it! I particularly hate the Beholder dungeon in the Underdark because you have to enter with your entire party and then immediately come under attack from a Beholder and an Elder Orb using such dirty tricks as Remove Magic and Dispel Magic. So even if one party member has the shield of cheese, that still leaves five members vulnerable to petrification, Death Ray and the powers only know what else. :nolike:
     
  19. Proteus_za

    Proteus_za

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    Glad I'm not the only one that has trouble with them!

    I feel (a little bit) bad taking them on with such cheesy methods, but I'm not sure what else to do. At least they are not too magic resistant, but certainly no pushovers, especially in large groups.
     
  20. Aldeth the Foppish Idiot

    Aldeth the Foppish Idiot Armed with My Mallet O' Thinking Veteran

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    The only time I clear the beholder cavern in the Underdark is when I use the shield of cheese, which I typically don't do. On my current playthrough with the monk, I rushed to get Imoen, so no shield. In that instance, I get in, fight the two as soon as you go in, grab the blood and equalizer blade (or is it the hilt?), and leave. Other than some XPs - OK, a lot of XPs, and some money - OK a lot of money probably in excess of 10,000 GP when you count the gem value - there's no "must have" items in there. The Greenstone Amulet is mostly worthless to me - I think the duration is one round - so nothing that's a serious impediment if you don't get it.

    Hell - even the blood and equalizer aren't entirely necessary - you don't have to get beholder blood, and by the time you can make the equalizer, chances are you have better weapon options.
     
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