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This game is obscenely good.

Discussion in 'BG2: Throne of Bhaal (Classic)' started by nataben1314, Jul 11, 2010.

  1. nataben1314 Gems: 10/31
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    I thought maybe I was missing something, only having an old video card and thus unable to play more contemporary games.

    So I got a fancy new video card, bought many of the major cRPGS (Morrowind, Oblivion, Fallout 3, NWN2, Witcher, Dragon Age, Mass Effect, Mass Effect 2).

    None of them are even in the same league as BG2. Dragon Age is close, but thats it.

    1) What is it about BG2 that makes it so incredibly good?

    2) Will there ever be a game of this caliber again?
     
  2. Caradhras

    Caradhras I may be bad... but I feel gooood! Veteran

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    1) My theory is that it has to do with the inner struggle between Good and Evil. Whether the Bhaalspawn will give in to the Taint or fight it. That alone makes the game much more interesting than most IE games (the IWD series is nice but not in the same league) or more recent CRPGs.

    2) Planescape Torment is another game that has many things going for it. I prefer BG myself but it's definitely a game worth playing.

    The original Fallout is my favourite CRPG. I was slightly disappointed by Fallout 2 because it was too sprawled out (and there are just too many cultural references that break immersion) but the first one is just perfect.

    Arcanum is a very interesting game but I haven't finished it yet (I've been meaning to for years). The combat system is a real pain but the atmosphere is really good.

    Vampire the Masquerade is a bit old graphic wise but it has a lot going for it provided you enjoy the World of Darkness setting.
     
  3. Balle Gems: 19/31
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    there is no game i have played for as long time as BG2, i recently good BG1 and just started a new campaign. while i don't play as much as i used too, i can never see myself getting tired of this. there are a ton of stuff in the original, and many and big mods, contributing to every part of the game, which can give very different game experiences.
    oh, and i LOVE the graphics
     
  4. Silverstar Gems: 31/31
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    BG2 is different from all other games, because it has it all:an epic story starring your character, lively NPCs people love or hate as if they are real-life people, the best monsters&dungeons&adventures a D&D game has to offer, plus its combat is never dull and offers many tactics and strategems for those inclined. While some people may say its graphics are horrible, it can't be further from the truth. The design of the world, cities, dungeons is top-notch and speaks of true artistic style, not like a feast of artificially rendered polygons of 'modern' games. No one can say a bad thing about the sound effects (ambient effects and combat sounds really captivate the scene) , music (epic and so memorable) or voice acting. (Irenicus fan anyone?) Simply the best of the best here.

    For me, mods are also a huge part of the never ending fun, you get to experience new things each time you play a different mod.

    No other game has managed to combine the fun of in-game combat with the liveliness and vastness of the in-game world and story of BG2. Some games has some of the charm: a near non-existent story and character interaction but awesome fights and tactics,Diablo II, for instance. While others have a vast world, deep and intriguing story and interaction:Arcanum is really a gem there, but its dreadful combat system and unbalanced rules/system drag the game down IMHO. PS:T is also known to be one of the best RPGs, and I agree from the first quarter of the game I have played, but its repeatitive and boring combat really bored me and I could not play further.

    To me, BG2 has all of the good points of other games and more, its unique charm, and with tons of mods to customize as you please to boot! I can say, it is the game of my life...
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2010
  5. NOG (No Other Gods)

    NOG (No Other Gods) Going to church doesn't make you a Christian

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    I think the only thing I don't like about BG2 is Irenicus's final exposition. It's too whiney and woe-is-me for me. Even then, though, the voice acting really brought it to life.

    I agree with Silverstar, BG2 is the ultimate combo-package. I'd also suggest Final Fantasy VI, as it has a very similar package (though more character/story, less choice/options). Mind you, I've played games that beat both of those hands down in one category, maybe two, but never all.
     
    starfox64 likes this.
  6. Sparky The Barbarian Gems: 5/31
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    It was the first game I ever played in which the NPC were not simply mindless automatons that do your bidding and never open their mouths.

    The depth of character interactions in SOA / TOB is incredible, making for a high level of re-playability. I've never seen it equalled, only imitated. Jaheira, Imoen, Minsc et al are much more like characters in a book than characters in a video game, and every time you re-read the book, it is slightly different.

    I still break it out at least once a year. It is my favorite fantasy world, ranking over Star Wars, Tolkien, or anything else. It's a shame the series ended almost a decade ago.
     
  7. Runescarred Gems: 10/31
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    As afore said, I think the main secrets of the game are the PC's dramatic and somewhat realistic story, as well as the elaborate, in - depth character interactions.

    I believe, however, that there is a third factor, as important as the other two. It is the rich world presented in the saga. It was not created for the game only, and it truly shows: the player is not the focus of Faerun at all (well, until he/she decides to become a God), just an important part of a whole. One simply knows that the Sword Coast, Athkatla, Saradush or Amkethran are a few of many, many locations within the world of the game. It provides the player with a really authentic experience - which is hard to do, considering the story takes place in a fantasy setting.
     
  8. NOG (No Other Gods)

    NOG (No Other Gods) Going to church doesn't make you a Christian

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    Rune, those are all critical factors, but I don't think they can be credited alone. I've seen games with rich storylines, in-depth worlds, and even good characters before, but with gameplay as stale as year-old bread, no challenge, no difference in classes or whatnot, they failed. I'd rather read a book than play a game that's trying to be a book rather than a game.

    BG2 wasn't that. BG2 was a book that was a game.
     
  9. 8people

    8people 8 is just another way of looking at infinite ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran

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    [​IMG] A game, particularly an RPG, needs the flexibility and differentiation between options to make each a worthwhile premise. BG2 was pretty successful in ensuring there were options for most classes, most party combinations and an opportunity for a variety of responses beyond saintly, baby eating, I agree, I disagree and blank with no personality.
     
  10. kmonster Gems: 24/31
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    The best thing about BG2 is the IE engine. Top down view, combat and exploring remind a lot on the classic Command&Conquer games.

    But you don't have to bother with building and controlling dozens of units the same time or fast reflexes. You only have up to 6 units and maybe a few summons and can pause the game anytime you want to give. And instead of one big battle which can takes hours you have many short mini battles which grant a sense of achievement every few minutes. So you can enjoy the classic RTS feel without the difficulties.

    I don't think there'll be a new game of this kind. There's no market for big budget mainstream rpgs with top down god mode view any more.
     
  11. Runescarred Gems: 10/31
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    Hm. Touche, I admit. I tend to judge everything as if it was a book (including song lyrics, lol) while the thing in question can be something entirely different. Your reply was kept in the context of the thread (as the OP clearly asked about the goodness of the game). Therefore, touche, I say again. :) Personally, I think I would still like the games that pretented to be books - 'well, that's just, like, my opinon, maaan'

    Also, in addition: it was not only a book that was a game, it was a game that was a choose - your - own - adventure book. And good as Nine Hells to boot.:cool:
     
  12. The Magpie

    The Magpie Balance, in all things Veteran

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    That's an excellent point, kmonster. Whilst technically dated -- even when BGII was released -- the IE was close to perfect as an RPG game engine, in no small part due to its technical simplicity. All too often, all that camera freedom in 3D games really gives you is the freedom to get the camera wedged somewhere from where you can't see anything that's going on.
     
  13. OberonZ Gems: 2/31
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    So can we safely say that BG is to RPGs on PC what Mario Brothers was to platform games on consoles? Both are absolute classics that revolutionized their genres. I doubt we'll ever see another classic such as BG, much the same way we'll never see another classic on console such as Mario. Sonic the hedgehog and Crash Bandicoot tried their best, but Mario is still king!
     
  14. Runescarred Gems: 10/31
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    I always pictured him as a shaman on his journey. You know: the shrooms. And the soundtrack was pretty rythmic... :D
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2010
  15. kmonster Gems: 24/31
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    No, the engine only lasted for 5 games. The rpg of that time which revolutionized the genre was Diablo. It introduced top down view with point and click control, revived a genre thought dead and removed RPGs from the nerd corner.
    BG didn't offer much which wasn't already available in Diablo or Fallout.
     
  16. OberonZ Gems: 2/31
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    Except a true D&D experience of course. No other game until BG was released actually utilized the D&D system properly...
     
  17. The Magpie

    The Magpie Balance, in all things Veteran

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    [​IMG]
    :hmm:
    Not so sure about that, though, kmonster. Fallout, whilst excellent RP-wise, had a turn-based combat system which, for me, killed a lot of the experience. Diablo is a short-lived, solo dungeon hack with little or no RP value but bags and bags of gothic atmosphere. It only really comes alive in multiplayer with a group of friends.

    On the other hand, BG is a much more deep experience than Diablo, and a much less frustrating one than Fallout. Technologically, it's probably inferior to both in some ways, but the way everything is done and put together makes things much more than the sum of their parts. In my mind, I saw it at the time as the heir to Ultima VII, with a free-roaming (if cliched) fantasy environment and loads of distracting sidequests.
     
  18. Caradhras

    Caradhras I may be bad... but I feel gooood! Veteran

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    Althoug I agree on what you're saying about Diablo, I disagree with your assessment of Fallout.

    Fallout turn based system was perfect for its setting. Turn based made it play like some kind of wargame allowing you to decide what your character was going to do quietly without engaging in mindless clicking like in Diablo (clicking everytime your character would hit was a bit overkill).

    The alternative would have been to turn Fallout into a shooter (what Fallout 3 tried) or to come up with an hybrid system (what Fallout Tactics was all about). I must say that I don't care much for Fallout Tactics as I found the mechanics of that game to be very frustrating and annoying whereas the Action Point /turn based system of Fallout 1 and 2 worked pretty well in the end.

    But then again, I've been playing Fallout 1 since 1997 and IMO no other game can be compared to that title. It has complete freedom, non linearity, depth, dialogue options that are just fantastic and a very tight structure (something the sequels severely lack -and I think Fallout 2 is really a flawed game as it was spoiled by too many tongue in cheek references).

    I'm not saying that what works for Fallout would have worked for BG. If we consider Arcanum or Lionheart Legacy of the Crusader we can only realize that the Fallout system didn't do particularly well in other settings but that is probably because they forced it to be real time instead of turn based.
     
  19. Marceror

    Marceror Chaos Shall Be Sown In Their Footsteps Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    My explanation of why Baldur's Gate II is so great is much more simplistic than many given here. Though I agree with most of what's been shared, the greatness of this game, really, is deeper than all those details. Why is it so great...?

    Magic

    Though magic is commonplace within the game world of Baldur's Gate, it is far less so in our world. But -- it exists, and Baldur's Gate 2 (and to a lesser extent, the original game) is one of the rare products of magic in our world. As such, it has become the standard by which CRPGs are judged.

    Bioware, at the time, had the right combination of talented and creative people, the right creative vision, and were doing this during a time before PC game development had become so intensely driven by conservative business ethics. It wasn't just about increasing shareholder wealth... it was about creating a masterpiece.

    It happened once. It might be a long time before it happens again. I won't say never.
     
  20. NOG (No Other Gods)

    NOG (No Other Gods) Going to church doesn't make you a Christian

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    Personally, I rank Fallout (or more specifically Fallout 2) as one of the chief competitors with BG2 for BEST RPG EVER. It was a wonderful game, with increadible atmosphere, a deep story, exellent choices, and a great combat engine. Once again, something of a 'total package' game. The only thing I didn't like about it was the lack of control of your party members.

    Comparatively, I found the choices in BG2 to be rather shallow. Sure, you could choose to rescue the kidnapped girl, or hold her ransom yourself, but it didn't make that much difference which one you chose. In Fallout 2, your choices have lasting consequences. You can't please everyone, so choose carefully who you do please.

    But, then, BG2 had romances, and overall better characters. And party control! Vic, put down the greande!
     
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