The "Reality" of a Personal Evil

BTA - that's a whole new topic, "What is TRUTH" and can one worldview claim to have objective truth.

I would hold that there is one objective truth which is revealed in manifold ways. Natural revelation = Natural Law. These are things that all groups hold to be true (more or less). Special Revelation would be (IMO) the Bible, which details more of the metaphysical Truths of the universe.

If there is no Objective Truth, then we cannot know or do anything, we cannot say anything, nor can we live in society.

 

I don't now knowledge of Religions but there is a difference between the Cristian religion and ANY other religion in the world.

 

Think about it for one moment... Why do people act with good morals? Answer: Because almost everyone benefits from it. If people act hostilly toward each other, almost nobody is happy besides the one. I think people have kind of come together and realized that it's better to treat one another decently because we function better that way. Of course, that still leaves the question of why there is evil still in the world.

 

Vile, I agree completely.
Though would we know what is good, if we did not know what is evil?

[This message has been edited by Darien Noella (edited July 07, 2001).]

 

well for me it ain't a question. Read Genesis........

 

Natural Revelation. Everything in general that we need to know is expressed through creation. (To me that answer isn't 100% satisfying, but its the best that I have)

 

that is quite a hard question and i wish i would've chimed in earlier i'm sure my opinion was swayed by all the previous posts but i'll try to give the untainted version.

what is evil exactly. it is hard to say one person's evil may be another person's good. it really is an abstract subject the whole idea of good and evil. for instance one might say that lying to someone is a horrible thing to do, but what if that lie was to spare the person's feelings or to quell a riot anything can be looked at as evil or good. truth on the other is completely the same for all people when one lies it is a lie to everyone they may not realize it but it still is, it is a completely literal term and one not to be taken in a realative sense, one person's truth is another person's lie simply makes no sense. and finally as for whether there is some ultimate manifestation of evil such as say satan, i cant say i believe in that in even the slightest, how can such a being of ultimate evil exist, for that to be true there would have to be an ultimate being of good, and if that were true in the end there would be ultimately just neutrality and i for one cannot see how someone can be neutral, to do so one would have to give up all of their feelings, thoughts and opinions which is humanly impossible.

 

Egg: The inbetween would be neutral, true. But on one side is evil and on the other is good. Staying neutral would be like walking a tightrope... you can't do it without training. It all comes down to which side you fall down on...

 

although u have a good point azardu i feel i must refute it in some futile attempt so here it comes: neutrality cannot exist for the very reason that the rope would be so thin that it would be none existant a concept covered in topology, so it would have no dimensions thus not existing, anything can be proven/refuted with minimal knowledge of mathematics and twisted logic

 

Ahh, mathematics, eh? Try this one then: Sway a little to evil, then back a little to good. Assign numbers to them, using evil as the negative part of the axis. Let's say then, that your evil actions are "-2" and your good actions are "2", then sum it up, and you get "0". You fall down on one side of the rope you cannot see, climb up again, and fall down on the other side. My definition of neutrality is to vary between good and evil all the time. Making the rope nonexistant would only make it easier to cross between them.

 

Egg - I think I get your point. It would be a much more logical debate to discuss the existance of absolute "Truth" instead of the existance of ultmate "Evil". (perhaps???)

From a biblical world-view, the questions intermingle. The Adversary (aka Satan or Lucifer) is called both evil and the Father of Lies.

As mentioned befrore, my main reason for asking this is to get a feel for some of the different Worldview's that we are interacting with on the Forum. Can't quite figure out yours yet . . .

 

BTA -- what exactly is an Objective Truth if there is no God behind it? "God" means an object of worship... if you are not worshipping a spiritual being greater than yourself, but you believe in an objective truth, sounds to me like you're worshipping yourself... feel free to sound off on me.

 

Actually, if you look at it from a purely scientific standpoint, there is no truly objective truth. Everything you know about the world is perceived and depends upon your frame of reference. However I thought we were talking about objective truth as it pertains to morality and religion. If you don't have a god behind the truth of what is moral, then you have the people determining what is moral, which by definition makes it subjective.

On another note, as a Christian I do not believe you get into heaven by being good. There is no debit/credit system where good works cancel out bad ones. The only thing accepted in heaven is perfection. (yay, am I ever opening a can of worms)

 

Since I believe in morality as defined by the Creator, naturally I believe that there is an objective or absolute morality. I also agree that in the final analysis, you can never know objective truth by logical reasoning. The reason for this is that all scientific analysis must be based on a set of fundamental assumptions or beliefs.

Scientists who mock religion have forgotten this fact. No matter whether you think God exists or not, you still have a fundamental set of beliefs. Without a framework to attach our perceptions and observations to, there can be no scientific progress. Science and religion are not at odds; rather, religion is the foundation that science is built on.