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*SPOILER* - Battle too tough

Discussion in 'BG2: Throne of Bhaal (Classic)' started by Trydan, Nov 24, 2003.

  1. Trydan Gems: 5/31
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    [​IMG] WARNING - CONTAINS SPOILERS

    I'm currently battling through ToB with a solo human Berserker (level 40, armed with Foebane +5, shield, magical full plate, AC=-14). I've just defeated Balthazar and had the cut scenes, and now I'm off to battle Melissan, having finally reached the throne of Bhaal itself.

    But I can't defeat her. She seems immune to my hits, summons in lots of creatures (skeletons, crimson shades, shadow lords, and so on), and sooner or later I get held/dominated/other-disabling-effect, the hit points click down and... dead.

    I've run the battle ten times or so now, with different tactics (run and fire missile weapons, rage+whirlwind, potions, etc.) but with no luck.

    Then I decided that maybe I need some help, and (from the last save point in the pocket plane), summon in a party to help me. I've tried the fighter approach (Keldorn, Minsc, Mazzy, Haer D'alis, Korgan) and the caster strategy (Edwin, Vicconia, Xan, Anomen, Aerie) but no luck - although, admitedly, these characters come in at about level 20, but still they have high level spells.

    When that didn't work, I dropped the game difficulty from "normal - core rules" to "very easy".

    However, still no luck. :(

    I'm getting desperate now... ideally, I'd like to finish the game with my solo character, but I'd recruit a group too, if it'd get me through.

    Any suggestions?
     
  2. Hyperion Gems: 4/31
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    Ok, that's odd... I've managed to beat Melissan from the first try. The bad part (at least for you) is that I've done that several months ago (maybe even a year), so I don't remember which strategies work and which don't. I was playing a Sorcerer, with Seravok, Korgan, Minsc in the front line followed by Jan and Aerie. I don't remember have that a hard time. My advice: concentrate on the spellslinger NPCs like Edwin, Viconia, maybe even Imoen. Summon some Planetars and Divas to distract Melissan's attention and use your fighters to inflict the real damage. Try using the Energy Blades too, might work a little. You said that you are a berserker. Strange. I'm sure that in my case Korgan and Seravok dealed the most damage. Korgan was dualwielding the Axe of Unyelding (sorry for the terrible spelling, but I think that you can still understand what I have to say) and the Runehammer/Crom Faeyr. I forgot about the Seravok. A powerfull two handed sword, anyway. I usually do not use enchantments on my party, so it is not the case. Whirlwind + berserk should do the trick. The summons are a must, because sometime you have to retreat for healing, and here is where Planetar comes in handy. Attack, retreat, attack, retreat, and so on... Do not attack while you are winded. Try this and then let me know if it worked.
     
  3. Rastor Gems: 30/31
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    Mellissan requires either +5 or +6 weapons to hit (I don't remember which), so that might be an issue, but I doubt it since I seem to remember +5 swords hitting her.

    One thing that may make the fight difficult is that her spear has a 25% chance to outright kill anything it hits. If I were you, I'd do whatever you can to increase your resistance to cold.

    Definitely use your rage. Anything you can get that will give you immunity to hold, charm, magic... will be a major (crucial?) help. Ignore her summons, and work on smashing her.

    Since you're soloing, hold, stun, charm, etc. will end the game. You must be immune to all of those. Use any potions you can.

    Honestly, I can't think of any realistic way to win the fight solo with a fighter, but do what you can. You must rage to win, there's no way around it. Hopefully that along with Greater Whirlwinds will help. Amy is immune to criticals, so don't bother with that ability.
     
  4. dragoon169 Gems: 3/31
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    lol ive never fought her before, but a good strategy i have for mages is casting insect swarm or creeping doom, or anything that makes it so they cant cast spells, so you could jus summon jaheira for the insect swarm/ creeping doom or something...

    and another thing, death spell can kill any summoned units instantly, iirc...that might help
     
  5. Cryonic Gems: 1/31
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    Death Spell only kills creatures with 8HD or less
     
  6. DarkGoddess Gems: 9/31
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    Dragoon, casting spells against Melissan is a complete waste of time. Her magic resistance is astronomical. Best of luck, Trydan, I didn't beat her solo, I had a full party attacking her. My best advice is to beat the hell out of her with Greater Whirlwind, but make sure that she's not killing you with spells either. It's hard to balance that all out, but, you'll get it eventually.
     
  7. Thyorna Gems: 6/31
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    In ToB especially but also towards the end of SoA as well, big bad bosses, you generally need a mage to allow your fighter to actually hit them, with their protections and all.
     
  8. Trydan Gems: 5/31
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    Thank you everyone for the advice. Working from my last saved game in the pocket plane, I've managed to make some progress, and have beat Melissan twice and fought the lesser evils on two of the adjacent platforms. I've engaged Melissan a third time, but no luck yet. However, I now have hope...

    Tactics:

    I summoned in Korgan, Keldorn, Anomen, Edwin and Aerie. Of course, they are only level 20, whereas my main character is 40. I can easily see that 6xlvl.40 characters would be much easier! The first three have been killed (I wonder whether I can rest on "the throne", to allow Aerie to rememorise Resurrect? The clerics were doing bless, aid, chant, chaotic commands etc. plus dealing with the summons and healing. Edwin has also dealt with the summons effectively, but makes no difference to the battle against Melissan herself. If starting the last battle again, I would have taken Viconia instead. My main character is a Human berserker, and I've swapped Foebane +5 for the Answerer +4, which seems to be better.

    Some comments:

    @Hyperion - Good advice. Thanks! I think your comments helped me get a long way into this.
    @Rastor - thanks for the tip about the +5/+6 weapons. That certainly saved me a few attempts with "wasted" +3 weapons. However... I noticed that "The Answerer" (+4) was getting hits in.
    @DarkGoddess - yes, I see your point about astronomical magic resistance. This is why I think now that Edwin wasn't a good choice.
    @Thyorna - I guess it is spells like lower resistance and dispel magic that do this, however, Melissan doesn't seem to use them.

    Anyway... I'll resume my attempts tonight! A status report will be forthcoming as I make more progress.
     
  9. Spelladonna Gems: 14/31
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    No, you cannot rest during the final battle against Melissan. If you have a wish scroll, and high enough wisdom, you can get an option which will essentially cause you to rest and rememorize spells/abilities.

    Using the Answerer was a good idea. With each hit lowering MR 15%, that'll make it easier for your mages to affect her with spells.
     
  10. Nobleman Gems: 27/31
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    I had a group of 3 beserkers and 3 barbarians around level 25-28 to beat her. Pretty tough fight indeed. Good job fighting Melissan solo. And yeah. The legendary Crom Feyer(+5) did again do the work for me here.
     
  11. Chris Williams Gems: 9/31
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    Melissan has -8 AC and requires only +3 weapons to hit, so Blackrazor, if you have it, will be a good choice. The Soul Reaver sword, if you have it and can use it, will reduce her capability to hurt you. She has 100% elemental resistance and 90% magic resistance. If you want to take some help from the Pocket Plane you may want to use The Answerer to wittle down her MR so she can be hurt with Horrid Wilting.

    The really hard thing about fighting Melissan is not her or her spear, it's her summons and constant casting of stoneskin. It really is a most unequal fight for a fighter type. If you simply want to finish the game and achieve godhood, why not use CTRL-Y on her?

    Couple of questions:
    How on earth did you beat Draconis with a solo fighter? The swine keeps turning invisible, casting stoneskin and summoning help.

    Death Spell works against Melissan's summons? I always assumed that she gated in her buddies so never tried it.
     
  12. Rastor Gems: 30/31
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    I'm almost 100% sure that +3 and +4 weapons will not work. I'll take a look at her creature file if you want, but I know that I kept getting the "Weapon Ineffective" message when I tried it.

    Nobleman,
    Crom Faeyr is +4 and will not hit Melissan.

    Unsurprisingly, Ctrl-Y won't work on Melissan.

    You're correct. Death Spell does not work on her summons, neither will most other spells (some of those punks have 100% MR).
     
  13. Chris Williams Gems: 9/31
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    I solo'd BG2 with a monk (the only time I've bothered playing a solo game). When it came to the final battle, I found that I couldn't beat Melissan fairly, so I cheated. CTRL-Y does the same 1,000-odd points of damage to her as it does to any other enemy.

    As an aside, I also found that I couldn't beat Draconis and Abigazal fairly either. No other enemy caused me too much trouble, although I didn't go through Watcher's Keep.
     
  14. Drust the good Gems: 1/31
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    If you can get her down the first time set traps where she comes back out, workers very well, also project image, and a few Planers will do the job.
     
  15. Rastor Gems: 30/31
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    Hmm, that's strange. Melissan should be immune to Ctrl-Y. Do you have the patch?
     
  16. chevalier

    chevalier Knight of Everfull Chalice ★ SPS Account Holder Veteran

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    Psionic sword, 2H, +5, protects you from mental control spells. A shield of whatever also has that ability. Bad luck if you need a +6 weapon, though. Or no... there's some helmet. Of what? Maybe stability of mind? I don't know, I don't have an English version.

    Perhaps headchopping weapons would work on her?
     
  17. Sparhawk the Pandion Gems: 14/31
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    Crom Faeyr is +5.

    I just checked her CRE, and she's immune via a ring to +2 and below. She must've had some protections on..Improved Mantle or something.
     
  18. Rastor Gems: 30/31
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    Confirmed. I was going off of a post made a while ago by someone else (don't remember who).

    As for Mel, Here are her complete stats and lists of immunities taken directly from the game files (I'm tired of trying to go off of memory).

    Level 30/30 CE Cleric/Mage
    Immune to Haste
    250 HP
    -7 THAC0
    5 Attacks
    -8 AC

    19 Str
    18 Int
    19 Wis
    20 Dex
    22 Con
    21 Cha

    100% Immune to Fire, Acid, Cold, Electricity
    90% Magic Resistance
    50% Resistance to any other form of damage

    Immune to all of the following:
    +2 Weapons and Lower
    Time Stop
    Charm
    Horror
    Poison
    Stun
    Any sort of Death Magic
    Feeblemind
    Disease
    Hold
    Any type of Confusion Magic
    Petrification
    Polymorph
    Imprisonment
    Maze
    Level Drain
    Teleport Field
    Wing Buffet (go figure. How would a PC use this?)
    Level 2 and Lower Spells
    Deathbringer Attack
    Any kind of Sleep spell
    Berserk

    Stats on her Spear:
    +5 Weapon
    Damage: 1d8+5 Piercing AND 2d10 Cold
    Slows Target
    Instantly kills any Summons
    -1 Bonus to All Saves (Inflicted on target-PC)
    Reduces Target's Magic Resistance by 5% each hit
    Reduces Target's AC by 5 per hit (This is why she never misses I guess)
    Stuns Target

    She also has a returning dart with the following:
    10 Attacks per round
    1d4+4 Damage with a +4 THAC0 bonus
    Stuns Target
    1d6 Cold Damage
    Inflicts a disease which does 1 damage every second

    Hopefully that ends any debate and gives you some ideas to beat her. Just by looking at the stats on that spear, I'd say you can't beat her with a solo fighter of any sort.
     
  19. CamDawg

    CamDawg The gaze of the Wolf reaches into our soul Veteran

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    Just a quick note to add about the "immune to wing buffet" effect: any effect that pushes a character around is considered a wing buffet. Her immunity basically means that if you hit her with the Staff of the Ram or the Ring of the Ram she's not going to go flying across the screen. Several bosses and physically large creatures have this immunity as well (Demogorgon and dragons for example).
     
  20. Trydan Gems: 5/31
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    [​IMG] Well, following the original post, and all your advice, I managed to finish the game with my Berserker. 'Twas a shame I couldn't solo him the entire way through, but at least I made it to the final battle, before needing to drag in assistance.

    Although, having seen the stats that Rastor posted, I've got no idea how I managed to do it. Still, done and done. :D
     
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