Newbie unleashes a Sorcerer/Paladin

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I just got the game the other day after years of BG happiness.

(at first, the amount of poorly written dialogue and the laborious menus got me down so much that I uninstalled. I have recovered since)

I gave up on my Barbarian, and began afresh with a paladin, with a view to multiclassing to sorceror. Currently I'm paladin (4)/Sorc (1). Early encounters weren't too hard, apart from the yuan-ti in the beggar area- flamestrike kills you rapidly if your attack can't disrupt it in time.

How should I develop/equip this character? I'd like to focus on the sorc side, now that I have a bit of tanking power. I thought that a greatsword would be good, since shields are a no-no.

As for armour... are there any feats that let me use armour without spell failure, or at least reduce the penalty? Failing that, I'll rely on buffs.

I decided not to boost any stats extremely at the start- the stats are as good as they can without costing multiple points to increase, so that I get more out of it. Everything from levelups should go into CHA, right?

Oh, are there any recipes from the forge guy in the city core that might prove helpful?

[ August 12, 2005, 18:30: Message edited by: Taluntain ]

 

Interesting character. You definitely do have to focus on one thing or the other so if you are going for Sorcerer all the way from here, you need to boost Charisma. Using armour will probably just be a pain so I'd stick to buffs, robes, rings etc.

 

Well, still spell gives you the ability to cast all spells without spell failure (even if you have full plate + tower shield), but all spells are treated as being 1 level higher (still magic missile is a lvl 2 spell, for example). Eventually - in HotU - with enough spellcraft you'll be able to get the automatic still spell epic feat, which at lvl 3 will make all your spells still ones, without raising the level.
So as for recipes, if you have the armor of comfort it is as good as you'll get for this chapter, if not the whitebone armor is ok, the chromatic breastplate is also cool but the ac is lower. And given how you intend to go greatswords, the harbinger kin is ok - +1 and a wee bit of fire damage for chests and the like.
Who's your hench(wo)man, btw?

---Spoiler---
Some give charisma-enhancing items that can become rather powerful - the sorcerer's ring can be quite useful.
---End of Spoiler---

 

The still spell thing... do I memorise spells differently to select that (once I have the feat), or does is simply raise the level of every spell, whether I want it to or not?

My henchman is the half-orc barbarian, since he just beats everyone up. Handy for chests and the like (better than Mr Okey-Dokey, anyway). I assume from the spoiler that there is a sorceror henchman somewhere?

 

If you want to memorise a 1st level spell as a Still Spell, you have to go to the 2nd level section of the spellbook, and there you will see an option for learning Still Spells (and a list of available 1st level spells).

Any other metamagic feat works that way, with the exception of the epic "Automatic" ones.

 

It might be a wee bit late to put this up, but if you're a sorc/paladin, my suggesstions would be:
1. use a shield (AC)
2. until you get strong enouth, use a henchman and then put a good use of death armor/mestil's acid sheath/elemental shield
3. take most levels in sorcerer, but add a paladin now and then for...
4. most (if not all) bosses are evil alignment, and becouse of your paladin levels...:
if you can't kill it with spells, buff up with divine might/holy weapon(that's the name IIRC...) and smite away.

I've tried this myself and i must say that it worked fairly well, i ended up with not needing many paladin levels. But in the early stages, i managed to kill off pretty much anything in a matter of 2-3 rounds (including bosses) thanks to them.

 

Actually, if you're a sorcerer, you don't memorise. When casting a spell, just go to the menu where you cast the spells of one level higher, go to metamagic and there should be the list of the spells you know of the lower level. To answer more directly your question, it is not automatic, you apply it to the spells you want.

When reviewing what a spell does, look for "somatic". Most spells have this property. But keep an eye out for those without somatic as you can cast them without spell failure, even without still spell feat.

 

Sounds good.

@meatdog- I meant spell selection when going up a level, not memorisation. My mistake.

Definitely using the Harbinger sword for now. Nice blade.

Are there any spells that I should really *avoid*? I've played through all the infinity engine games, so I know more or less what to look for, but are there any that are bugged, or are described as being better than they really are?

 

I don't think I can say anything new. Just be mindful of everything and especially the stats division. You will obviously want a high CHA score for sorcerous spells and paladin buffs. I wouldn't advise raising DEX above 10 because you will need a stat to improve your AB and DEX would require Finesse to work and a low-damage weapon unless it's a rapier.

Since there is no holy sword in the OC, you might as well take up the rapier and make use of its extended threat range by taking the Improved Criticals feat as soon as possible. DEX will improve both your Attack Bonus and Armour Class but it won't help your damage. In the OC, there are lots and lots of enemies with damage resistance, so you might be willing to do yourself a favour and go the Strength route instead. You can still take a bladed weapon and Improved Criticals for some melee ownage. Katana might be a good idea since your STR isn't going to be that of an average tank and there are also quite paladinish katanas in the game, even if they aren't technically holy swords.

However, the best way to deal the most damage in melee is to use a two-handed weapon. And since you won't be using shields anyway, you might as well go the two-handed route. In such a case, you'd better forget about DEX and even CON and get a 14 STR from start, since two-handed weapons use 1.5 times your STR bonus. When you get Bull's Strength, this is going to increase even further.

Another option would be two-bladed sword or perhaps two-headed mace. However, I don't know if you need the two-handed feats to handle this weapon without penalties. I just don't know if it counts as dual-wielding or not. I've heard different things from different people.

You might also be willing to try the Dragon Disciple prestige class with this build. There are some bonuses which will increase the efficiency of both your regular classes.

 

Chev, could you explain this? I must be reading the above wrong as what I got from it was you suggesting he not raise his DEX higher than 10. Then, you say he should take Weapon Finesse and rapier which benefit from having a high/decent DEX. I read it that you're contradicting yourself.

 

@ kuemper: I don't think he's contradicting himself - I think that chev means to recommend wielding rapiers as normal weapons (i.e. no Finesse feat, just rely on STR). Of course, you could equally well go for scimitars, depending on what magical weapons are knocking around in the campaign.

@chev: double-bladed weapons definitely require dual-wielding feats to avoid the hefty penalties. As a bonus, though, the "off-hand" blade always counts as a light weapon for calculating the penalties, so with 2WF & Ambidexterity you'll get -2/-2, with 1-8 damage on each attack. You still get the reduction of the STR bonus on the off-hand, however.

 

Thank you for clearing that up, Magpie! His post makes more sense now.

 

Well, I'm paladin4/sorc 6 right now. Some enemies are trivial, then the next will be a nightmare. Power attack is a lifesaver, but I never use parrying, for some reason. Just doesn't seem to be worth it, despite how cool it is when weapons block eachother.

Still spell is alright- good tip there. 5 magic missile uses despite my armour of truth is nice.

I don't have any expansions, so prestige classes are out, as are epic feats.

I have 14 STR, 18 CHA and 12 or 10 in everything else. I'm now using the ravager halberd for the bonus sonic damage and the glowy effect. Definitely the glowy effect. I decided to avoid 2 weapon fighting since it's a drain on the number of feats.

Since I'm in chapter 2, i have a nice wide choice of henchmen. Who is good for me? I'm using the bard atm.

 

@kuemper: No, I suggest he shouldn't raise his DEX and take Finesse unless for rapier. Only then would it make sense. But still probably not as much as taking a good old longsword. Or two-handed, if he isn't going to use a shield, anyway. It might be a good idea to dual-wield a katana with a rapier but this would require many feats to accomplish.

Of course, you can still take a rapier as a normal weapon, as Magpie says. Probably not so bad an idea. Must do the calcs...

Edit: Done the calcs. There's no way a rapier could outmatch a longsword unless you simply put everything into DEX, raising both your AB and AC, and use this to your advantage. With a large amount of bonuses that multiply on a critical hit, the rapier's disadvantage diminishes but it still doesn't fade completely. For a light weapon with an increased threat range, you would need big amounts of damage to pay off over a classic sword or mace, let alone two-handed sword. However, if you go the STR route and still take rapier, it might actually pay off this way, since the amount of damage you do will be so high that the difference between 1d6 and 1d8 won't matter much.

So, as dual-wielding is similarly overrated, I suggest you grab 2d6... (Translation: Choose two-handed sword as your weapon.) Just remember to have protective spells cast so you won't be hit so often with the resulting low DEX.

Edit: I've done some more calculations and it seems that when all your various damage bonuses stack up to 30 and you have Improved Criticals with your weapon, rapier becomes slightly more profitable than longsword. If you always hit and always for max damage, you could score 842 damage total with a longsword and 864 with a rapier. For +50 to damage, this would be 1302 and 1364 respectively.

However, in reality you don't always and you don't confirm all criticals. In short, the less you depend on high rolls, the better off you are. This is actually why the extended threat range of bladed weapons (19-20, X2) isn't necessarily better than the 20, X3 of blunt weapons, axes and the like.

Finessed characters, however, tend to hit more often because their DEX tends to be higher than the STR stat of your average meatshield. Still, with such a low STR as they tend to have, they aren't in the same damage league unless it's late in the game where your bonuses add up to 30 or 50 or whatever such anyway.

In short, again, get the damn zweihander.

[ August 14, 2005, 13:52: Message edited by: chevalier ]

 

There are two ways to go when it comes to a tank/mage. One is to increase your AC. Do that by wearing a tower shield (so forget that halberd and greatsword). I mean, as long as you're making the sacrifice of using Still Spell, why not use a shield as well?

Before venturing into a dungeon, take off that armor and shield and 'buff up' i.e. cast spells on yourself like Protection from Evil (total immunity to mind spells), Improved invisibility (monsters will miss you 50% of the time), stoneskin, Mage Armor, etc. Then put the armor on, put the shield on and venture forth and chuckle as monsters swing and miss you constantly. You can whack them with a sword or zap them with spells.

Option two is to not worry about AC -- in fact the lower AC the better! Cast Elemental Shield on yourself (a flaming circle forms around you); cast stoneskin on yourself (and eventually Greater Stonesksin and Premonition). Stand in the thick of things and encourage monsters to hit you! They will die to the fire shield (unless they are fire immune). If you had the expansions you could cast Death Armor or Mestil's Acid Sheath on yourself as well. This method is almost too cheezey but hey, it's an option.

For kicks: wield a mage's staff along with that tower shield and full plate. Yes, it can be done. Not the most powerful weapon but it completes the "full metal mage" look, and isn't looking cool what it's really all about?

 

Full metal mage, gotta love the sound of that

I'll have to try it sometime... char name Edward Elric, of course