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Nalia's classes.

Discussion in 'BG2: Shadows of Amn (Classic)' started by Dranalis DeAealth, Jun 30, 2004.

  1. Dranalis DeAealth

    Dranalis DeAealth Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc Veteran

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    Why is Nalia firstly a thief, and secondly a mage?

    This makes no sense in terms of her background. We are told that her mother insisted that she be trained in magic, and it is alluded to that she only acquired her thievery skills during presumably late-night forrays outside the castle. Thus, it would make greater sense if she was primarily a mage, and then a thief. Or a multi-class Mage/Thief. (Is this a possible combo? - I don't usually use muti-class.) The Thief/Mage dual class arrangement currently makes little sense.

    Yes, I am a pedant.
     
  2. david w Gems: 19/31
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    Probably because of her impish nature, thief was a more natural start for her. But as her thieving abilities don't improve throughout SOA and TOB, and her mage abilities do improve, she'll soon end up a far better mage than a thief.
     
  3. Dranalis DeAealth

    Dranalis DeAealth Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc Veteran

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    I'm not disputing the need for balancing the game, etc, I'm saying that the stated reason for her given classes doesn't make much sense.
     
  4. Aldeth the Foppish Idiot

    Aldeth the Foppish Idiot Armed with My Mallet O' Thinking Veteran

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    To answer your other question, mage/thief is a valid multi-class, however since Nalia is a human, she would NOT be able to multi-class, but dual-class is an option for her.

    Edit: added "NOT"

    [ July 01, 2004, 14:15: Message edited by: Aldeth the Foppish Idiot ]
     
  5. CamDawg

    CamDawg The gaze of the Wolf reaches into our soul Veteran

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    @Aldeth
    You missed a 'not' in there, but we get the gist. :)

    If Imoen's appearance as a mage bothers you, grab the G3 Tweak Pack--it has a component (separate, in case you don't want any of the other stuff) that changes Imoen's avatar to a mage.
     
  6. Dranalis DeAealth

    Dranalis DeAealth Sic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc Veteran

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    I'm not bothered by it. I'm just pointing out something which appears to be a logical inconsistency.

    Sorry for all the fuss. :o
     
  7. Eltharodo Gems: 2/31
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    I see it this way;

    When she was growing up, she learnt all the little tricks like opening locks, diarming traps etc., but to a very small degree. She can still use these becuase she hasn't forgotten how, but she didn't ha\ve enough oppurtunities to keep them in practice and improve them because of her magic training. Thus, becuase she has been forced into mage training, her days of improvng her thief skills are over <an excuse for dual classing if you want>. Dual classing basically means shifting your attentions to something else entirely, as opposed to the multi-class approach of combining both. Y'see?
     
  8. ShaineCoradara Gems: 2/31
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    Nalia is a very bad thief. And her mage skills aren't all what they're cracked up to be either. And (just to throw everyone off here) if you want to be a mage/theif, be a half-elf. Humans suck at it. Humans pretty much suck at most things.
     
  9. Evil Dad Gems: 15/31
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    I think Nalia's thieving skills came about due to her agility and eagerness to explore her castle, but, being a noble she had to learn the books at an early age and discovered an aptitude for magic. Think of her thieving skills as a natural aptitude rather than formal training.

    @ShaineCoradara:

    Nalia isn't meant to be your thief (but you can use her as your main thief if you need to). She is really just a single class mage, with better weapons and a few extra hit-points. The only mage better than her in the game is Edwin (Imoen, Aerie and Jan are not as good as her as mages). But, Edwin's a better than everyone including the PC as a mage.

    As to the best mage/thief, you forgot the Elf and Gnome. Both far better than half-elf. Oh, a human can be a great mage/thief depending on what level you dual-class.
     
  10. Capt Massacre Gems: 5/31
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    I'm surprised by what you're saying. In my version of the game (after "Baldur Dash"), Imoen is a better mage (more spells, like she were a specialist) and a decent thief (enough to detect/disarm and unlock).
    But I wonder if the patch didn't make her too powerful.
    Often, I play with Nalia in the beginning - and she's great -, but when I know I'm gonna find Imoen back, I ditch her.

    "Oh, a human can be a great mage/thief depending on what level you dual-class"
    So is Imoen
     
  11. PsiVen Gems: 1/31
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    How is Nalia better than Imoen? Just based on the stuck-on equipment she has?
     
  12. Evil Dad Gems: 15/31
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    Nalia will be at least 1-2 levels higher than Imoen by the time you get her back from Spellhold, plus she could have learnt and used all those useful spells in the meantime.

    I you rush to get Imoen, she will be comparable. And, okay, towards the end of the game Imoen would catch up but those couple of mage levels can make a big difference.

    I am not disputing Imoen is a good mage/thief, she is. She isn't great though, as she levelled too early to be a great thief - she will get you through the game well enough though. But, Nalia isn't really a mage/thief - she is a mage primarily.

    Most people won't take Nalia as she looks like a poor imitation of Imoen. They aim to have Imoen as the main mage, and take Jan or Haer'D as a backup mage. Why not keep Nalia as your main mage and use Imoen as your backup mage.
     
  13. Aldeth the Foppish Idiot

    Aldeth the Foppish Idiot Armed with My Mallet O' Thinking Veteran

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    First I have to address this:

    That's a completely unfair comparison, as half-elves multi-class, while humans dual-class. If you're arguing that a multi-class mage is more useful than a dual-class mage, I'm apt to agree with you, but it has nothing to do with the inherent value of the races.

    I also agree with Bard that an elf or a gnome (and thereby being a illusionist/thief instead of a mage thief) is a far better choice than half-elf for the multi-class.

    Now to address the differences between Nalia and Imoen. First of all, Nalia comes with what is probably the most useful spellbook in the game at the time you acquire her. With the exception of not having magic missile, she has just about every spell from levels 1-5 that you will use with any regularity.

    As Bard stated, Imoen has better thief skills, and unlike Nalia is servicable to use as your thief (I suppose with enough potions and items Nalia would do, but this is not recommended). However, in terms of mage ability, Nalia will always exceed Imoen by a couple of levels, and possibly even 3-4 levels if you do all of the Chapter 2 quests before leaving for Spellhold. As a result of this, Nalia is always able to cast more spells than Imoen (Imoen will never catch up in levels because once you hit Level 11 there is a fixed difference between levels) and until Imoen gains the ability to cast level 9 spells, Nalia will actually be able to cast spells from a full spell level higher than Imoen. Nalia will have level 7 spells while Imoen has only level 6, Nalia will have level 8 spells when Imoen has only level 7, etc. So I am very apt to agree with Bard that in terms of magic ability, Nalia is second only to Edwin.
     
  14. LKD Gems: 31/31
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    I seem to have a Nalia fixation today, which is weird, considering that I haven't used her for a while. I'm not fond of her starting spellbook -- to be honest, I'm not fond of ANYONE'S starting spellbook. The thing about Nalia is, she's an interesting character and all, but all her thieving dual class did was, as someone put it, improve her weapon choices and add a few hit points. As a thief she sucks, and as a mage, well, I prefer to play mages myself (usually multi classed ones), so I'd rather take Jan along, as he gets better as both a mage and a thief (his being an illusionist helps a lot, too)

    I think her dual class is totally understandable -- like many kids, she had a bit of a wild streak in her, and picked up a few tricks exploring the castle and sneaking out to aid the poor.

    However, she's not stupid, and decided to take the path of magic, as it would permit her to use her family's money in a way that she could eventually better help the less fortunate. She'd have been a REALLY naive fool to walk away from the benefits of her family's wealth to pursue the life of a thief.
     
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