1. SPS Accounts:
    Do you find yourself coming back time after time? Do you appreciate the ongoing hard work to keep this community focused and successful in its mission? Please consider supporting us by upgrading to an SPS Account. Besides the warm and fuzzy feeling that comes from supporting a good cause, you'll also get a significant number of ever-expanding perks and benefits on the site and the forums. Click here to find out more.
    Dismiss Notice
Dismiss Notice
You are currently viewing Boards o' Magick as a guest, but you can register an account here. Registration is fast, easy and free. Once registered you will have access to search the forums, create and respond to threads, PM other members, upload screenshots and access many other features unavailable to guests.

BoM cultivates a friendly and welcoming atmosphere. We have been aiming for quality over quantity with our forums from their inception, and believe that this distinction is truly tangible and valued by our members. We'd love to have you join us today!

(If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us. If you've forgotten your username or password, click here.)

Law, Judgement and Justice

Discussion in 'Alley of Dangerous Angles' started by Ragusa, Dec 22, 2004.

Page 2 of 2
  1. Beren

    Beren Lovesick and Lonely Wanderer Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2002
    Messages:
    3,953
    Media:
    1,157
    Likes Received:
    250
    Gender:
    Male
    Remove all ads!
    This topic is about (at least I understand it as such) the relationship between law and justice, with a particular focus on criminal justice.

    Discussions of minority rights and such can be taken up in another thread.
     
    Beren, Jan 1, 2005
    #21
  2. Morgoth

    Morgoth La lune ne garde aucune rancune Veteran

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2002
    Messages:
    3,652
    Media:
    8
    Likes Received:
    86
    Gender:
    Male
    But if we strive for justice for the person, the committer of the crime, where do we stop?

    For example, let's take Marc Dutroux, who is quite well known in West Europe, for abducting, raping and murdering a couple of young girls.
    Almost all people would call him 'vile and evil', but we can come up with mitigating circumstances for him too, right?

    Marc was driven by a couple of desires, lust and sexual power over young girls. This drive was distorting him so badly that he actually committed the deed.
    Could it have happened if he was stronger of will? Can it be blamed upon him that he had not enough will to stand against the desire, or that he actually had the desire?
    What if we see this desire as a handicap, we see autism as a mitigating circumstance, so why not pedophilia, or even better, a lack of will!

    So how can we blame it upon him to:
    - be born as a pedophile.
    - desire for sexual power over young children, partly as a result of his pedophilic nature,
    partly for a reason many rapers would share, traumatic oppression perhaps when he was young?
    - have not enough will to stand against these desires.
    - actually commiting the deed as a cause of having not enough will.
    - 'be' a monster as result of committing the deed and getting caught.

    Gee, if these are not mitigating circumstances, then what are?
    Sorry to have arrested you Marc, happy vacation in Vietnam, I'm sure you're not going there for the child-prostitutes, and write a card will ya?

    If we would arrest him then, and sentence him for live, would that then not be injust?
    The world is not meant to be just.


    And about the minorities thing, justice and law are defined and uphold by the majority.
    It's just that the majority sees that if they let the minorities 'get oppressed' then it's not 'truly a democracy'.
    And because the ideal 'democracy' is so battered into the heads of the majority when they were young, they believe that democracy is the one and only just governmental system.

    [ January 02, 2005, 00:17: Message edited by: Morgoth ]
     
    Morgoth, Jan 1, 2005
    #22
  3. Gnarfflinger

    Gnarfflinger Wiseguy in Training

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2004
    Messages:
    5,423
    Likes Received:
    30
    Beren, I believe the tangent on minority rights that seemed to thread jack this debate seems to have sparked from part of my thoughts on the original topic:

    My point would be that laws should reflect the morality of the majority. It was meant to close the door on certain things that one minority could force on society that would be an outrage (child pornography, offensive practices under the guise of religeon). It has been seen in the recent election in the US where 11 states voted NOT to allow same sex marriage. I was defending the right of the majority to make that law.
     
    Gnarfflinger, Jan 4, 2005
    #23
Page 2 of 2
Sorcerer's Place is a project run entirely by fans and for fans. Maintaining Sorcerer's Place and a stable environment for all our hosted sites requires a substantial amount of our time and funds on a regular basis, so please consider supporting us to keep the site up & running smoothly. Thank you!

Sorcerers.net is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to products on amazon.com, amazon.ca and amazon.co.uk. Amazon and the Amazon logo are trademarks of Amazon.com, Inc. or its affiliates.