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It appears that I now need a desktop too . . .

Discussion in 'Techno-Magic' started by dmc, Jan 17, 2011.

  1. Chandos the Red

    Chandos the Red This Wheel's on Fire

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    This is what I'm talking about. This is high-end: 3 graphics cards and SSD Raid. But only 12Gigs of RAM. I could have fun sellling one of these.

    http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/Gamer_Xtreme_XE/

    And this one still only has onboard audio! It's still another 175.00 for a high-end sound card.

    While I have not sold computers for 10 years, the high-end machines were custom builds, usually through HP or Compaq -- BACK THEN.

    On a 600-700.00 Packard-Bell computer I made $1.25 commission. Really. A whole 1.25. I know that sounds absurd, but that's because the store made next to nothing on it. On a high-end custom build I could make about 60.00-80.00 commission. That does not include monitor, printer, and of course the extended warranty [that really added income].

    http://build.falcon-nw.com/

    Falcons are nice too. I configured one @ around 4K.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2011
  2. Barmy Army

    Barmy Army Simple mind, simple pleasures... Adored Veteran

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    Did you know that the core i5 2500k Sandy Bridge is actually benchmarking higher than the core i7? Intel kind of shot themselves in the foot with that one.
     
  3. Silvery

    Silvery I won't pretend to be your friend coz I'm just not ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran

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    DMC, you may want to restart this thread and put NO TECH SPEAK, I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE ON ABOUT!!! in big flashing letters. You know better than to ask this lot to explain something simply because you aren't an expert :lol:
     
    dmc likes this.
  4. dmc

    dmc Speak softly and carry a big briefcase Staff Member Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!)

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    Silvery - repped!!!
     
  5. T2Bruno

    T2Bruno The only source of knowledge is experience Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    I've alway found that, in general, the requirements for current games lag the current technology for computers by at least two years. Add to that, I never buy a game at first release and generally wait until it's been out a year and don't like FPS (which typically have the high requirements on computers) -- I can buy nearly any computer on the market and still be able to play any game for the next two years. For example my three year old computer (bought on sale from New Egg) easily meets the recommended requirements for Fall Out III (which I haven't bought yet).

    Just look at the recommended requirements for the games you want to buy and you'll see they are well below the capabilities of computers on the market. You should be able to find an adequate computer for under $1000. If, two years from now another game comes along requiring the abilities of the $2000-3000 computer of today, you will be able to buy it at that time for probably under $1000 (overall giving a net savings and a new toy in two years).
     
  6. dmc

    dmc Speak softly and carry a big briefcase Staff Member Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!)

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    Just to echo a little of what T2 wrote and what Silvery wrote, a couple of things:

    I need this computer to run current games and the next couple that come out.

    I don't need it to run them at max frame rate, top eye candy, couldn't be smoother if one of NASA's machines were running it, etc.

    Hell, my 44 year old eyes probably can't appreciate top eye candy in a game anyway (no one gets to comment on top eye candy outside of a game -- that's reserved for the MUG).

    And let's all remember that the game I am playing the most these days is Diablo 2, so I'm not exactly cutting edge. I want to be able to run Diablo 3 and I want to see for myself how good DAO is and, evenually DA2.

    So with all that said, does that change anything?

    (And please, simple words in plain English or a link to a system like CtR did earlier that I can check out the components and pretend like I understand it.)

    You guys really know your stuff, but I don't, so Sandy Bridge benchmark to me means something like a chair on a nice boardwalk at the beach . . .
     
  7. Chandos the Red

    Chandos the Red This Wheel's on Fire

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    Yes, we should get back to DMC, rather than debating the land of where little old ladies buy $60,000 Cadillac Escalades to drive up to the corner grocery store, when they could have spent far less on a Chevy and can get there just as easily.

    Essentially the same thing as the Intel. I would at least upgrade to a quad core for just 54.00. So w/ W7 and monitor it should be under 1K.

    http://www.cyberpowerpc.com/system/Mega_Special_II/

    You don't have to go with this brand, but something similar.
     
  8. Merlanni

    Merlanni Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!)

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    Last edited: Jan 20, 2011
  9. dmc

    dmc Speak softly and carry a big briefcase Staff Member Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!)

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    OK - so just going apples to apples here, is a phenom significantly better than an athlon? If so, then going quad core athlon is +54 and quad core phenom is +70, although I'm sure the little numbers to the right of the name mean something as well.

    You seem ok with the ATI Radeon HD 5670, and the NVIDIA GeForce GTX 460 1GB is about $100 more, so I take it that this will be OK for the price point.

    I'm assuming that 500W Power Supply is more than adequate, no?

    On the OS, any reason to do more than Win 7 home premium?

    With the lowest price Phenom quad core and the Win 7 home premium, the price is $1028, although it appears that they are offering a 5% discount if I tell them to take their time shipping it.


    Edit: Saw Merlanni's post after the fact. Merlanni - the one you posted appears to be roughly the same as Chandos' one (once I swapped out the processor) given that the manufacturer's warranty on yours is 1 year and Chandos' is 3 years. Once I equal the warranty by buying Newegg's extended warranty, they are within $50. I assume that changing the athlon in yours to the phenom that I did in Chandos' would eat up most of that gap.

    In short, it looks like we are talking roughly $1000 for a gaming rig and new monitor that will do what I need it to do at the moment.
     
  10. Munchkin Blender Gems: 22/31
    Latest gem: Sphene


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    The only exception to this rule is Crysis. All other games may pass it but not Crysis.

    ---------- Added 0 hours, 1 minutes and 26 seconds later... ----------


    Phenoem has L3 Cache and may have higher L2 cache; Athlon does not have any L3 Cache which newer more intense applications tend to use.

    As for the Power Supply (PSU); it all depends on the various components installed, will the CPU/GPU be overclocked, and the actual PSU itself. If you go with a name brand PSU (Antec, Corsiar, etc...) you should be fine with a 500W PSU if you don't have to install a GPU that requires a 6+2 pin connector and a 6 pin connector.
     
  11. Splunge

    Splunge Bhaal’s financial advisor Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    I've done a bit of research recently, and I think the answer is yes (depending on what you consider to be "significant"). Just stay away from the X6 (6 cores), as it seems this is more suited to threaded applications (whatever those are) than gaming.

    The more I think of it, the more I'm tempted to go with the first choice in my previous post - i7 2600K, 8GB ram, HD 6850. It's $1,250, but I tend to hold on to computers for a long time (I bought my current one 7 years ago), so I think it makes sense.

    As an aside, I'm pleasantly surprised to see that prices on the Canadian newegg site are actually slightly lower than on the US site. This shouldn't be a surprise given that the Canadian dollar is currently worth a bit more than the US dollar, but in general, even with the two dollars being roughly equal in value, Canadian prices are higher than those in the US, often by 20% or more. It really pisses me off (along with every other Canadian), particularly given that I might also be in the market for a new car later this year.
     
  12. Munchkin Blender Gems: 22/31
    Latest gem: Sphene


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    Most applicatiosn today will benefit from 2-6 cores. If the application can use more than 2 cores than CPU with 3+ cores will see improvements on application performance. As software moves from 32 to 64 bit the more cores the better.
     
  13. Chandos the Red

    Chandos the Red This Wheel's on Fire

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    No, but probably a slight difference. Again if you look at the benchmarks for games the Athlon 640 is pretty close to the performance of the Phenom 940. They are only a few frames apart. Since you will be using it for games and not other applications the difference is not significant. You could go with the 640 for just 50.00 rather than 54.00.

    The nVidia GTX640 would be worth the extra C in my opinion.

    Yes, for the parts that it will be running.

    Just click the tabs to see the difference:

    http://windows.microsoft.com/en-US/windows7/products/compare?T1=tab20

    Splunge - What do you mostly use your PC for?
     
  14. Taza

    Taza Weird Modmaker Veteran

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    I'd still say the GTX 460 1GB is worth the extra cash. It's a fantastic card at a sweet spot.

    I'd also rather go with an i5 than a Phenom, but that's more personal preference in desktops. *Decidedly* Phenom over Athlon, though.

    @Chandos: Well, I see our definitions of "high end" and "gullible" are rather far away from each other.

    Because a system with 3 graphics cards and 2 SSD's is not a system you use... for anything, really. It hogs power in a ridiculous fashion, and you could throw in a full HD display and run every game for the next two years at max settings... or you *could* if it wasn't Crossfire. It's not "high end", it's "grotesquely inappropriate for any purpose".

    So you'd go decidedly into the "gullible" section of populace buying that overpriced monstrosity.

    Whereas the sane thing is to buy something that will run everything now for $1000, and then buy another machine like it for $1000 in two years - getting you all the practical performance of that monstrosity at half the price. Or better yet, shave $200 of that, and have something that runs with OK performance.

    @dmc: Couldn't run smoother if it ran on NASA's systems? NASA's systems pretty much can't run modern games... because they don't build systems for gaming, they build them for practical purposes, and the hardware tends to be drastically different.
     
  15. Silvery

    Silvery I won't pretend to be your friend coz I'm just not ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran

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    Well bugger me. I thought that this was a thread to give dmc advice on a new computer without the techno babble. Silly me. It was obviously an open invitiation to patronise other peoples opinions and talk about things that contain a lot of numbers
     
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  16. Chandos the Red

    Chandos the Red This Wheel's on Fire

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    I never said that a system in that range would be a good value, since it clearly isn't. Although I thought Ragusa's strategy was pretty sound, and it seems to be working out for him. The best bang for the buck is in the middle. My only point is that there are people who want the best, and don't care about the money. I've had customers say, "my neighbor just got a new computer. I'm tired of listening to him and I want something better."

    As I said, working on the other side of the counter changes your perspective.
     
  17. Silvery

    Silvery I won't pretend to be your friend coz I'm just not ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran

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    Chandos, don't bite. It only encourages him. Taza, stop attention seeking. We all know you're a very special and intelligent being...blah blah blah. get back onto the point which is: helping someone with something that is (for them if not you) a difficult purchase
     
  18. dmc

    dmc Speak softly and carry a big briefcase Staff Member Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!)

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    Taza - can you give me a link to what you are talking about? As you might have noticed, a bunch of posts ago, Chandos linked to a machine with certain specs that I was able to tinker with, etc., so if you've got something like that, I'd love to review it. Much appreciated.
     
  19. Chandos the Red

    Chandos the Red This Wheel's on Fire

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    OK. I'll take your advice. ;)
     
  20. Silvery

    Silvery I won't pretend to be your friend coz I'm just not ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran

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    Good puppy.
     
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