Is God really upstairs?

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And then there is the posibility that god and heaven ect. is all a figment of our immaginations. perhapes ther is no god no afterlife no heaven, perhapes after death we simply cease to exist having never been more or less than a human being trying to comfort our selves with thoughts of the life after.

 

That is what i said to start with!
It seems to me that we have turned full circle!

 

But is there any proof against this? And to we really know what the paradise described in the bible is like? Maybe it's just a release from our miserable lives on this planet. Paradise is described in the bible, the bible might be true, there is no proof against it. Simply believe.

 

The bible isn't just written after Jesus his death by a few persons. There are parts of the bible found that are written before his death, and secondly, in the Isrealian religious history you would see they already had the bible and believed in it before Jesus came to earth. So coem with better arguments to try to prove that the bible isn't true.

 

"Come up with better arguments to prove the bible issnt true" AM I HEARING CORRECTLY!!??
bwahaha!!!

 

If we threw that book away, would we all live in peace. Like the song "Imagine"? If true faith comes from within anyway?

After this debate I can see all Your points. And they are valid enough in My opinion.

But I still think religion as a concept, the whole sum of the Earth's beliefs, is bringing more pain that redemtion. But that doesn't matter does it. Because redemption is given to those that admit their sins. no matter what they conducted of sinisters acts in their life (holy war etc).

The earth is actually just the playground to heavenly acceptance. Good or evil doesn't matter. Only grace.

 

? I don't get you? Ever heard of sarcasm? I need no arguments for I know the Bible is true, but If you wanna try to prove that the bible is NOT true, say something useful instead of that laught that only proves stupidity.

 

Go ahead, tell us why the Bible's wrong. I'm ready.

If you're truly curious as to why we believe in it, study its prophecies. The Bible isn't like modern day psychics; it prophesied very specific events, many of which sounded completely ludicrous, if not impossible. Nonetheless, these prophecies came to pass, and were in many cases historically documented.

As to those who would say that the Bible is not historical or isn't accurate because of the copying/translation process, that is even more ludicrous. If we discount the Bible on this basis, we have to scrap every document ever written before the Middle Ages, and many that were written after. I don't have the statistics at the moment, perhaps I can post them later.

 

Hi Capstone.

I haven't read the bible and I guess many other boardmembers haven't either. I am interested in what "impossible" prophecies the bible has foreseen. NOT to question Your statement but of mere CURIOUSITY. You don't have to type a whole lot. I am aware of Your limited time, currently.

 

i have no arguments to prove the bible false. i am only laughing at the belief that it is true. i do not claim to know it either is false or true. i am only laughing because i have seen, that by and by, your faith is in the bible, not truly in god. many people do not own nor have read the bible. yet they are true of heart. they know god, they love god. they make no arguments to prove their faith, because there can be none. man is not to know the ways of god. god is in their hearts, in their souls. they know that which cannot be put into words. god will decide in the end, bible or no bible. good or evil, right or wrong, we are not to decide, the bible is not to decide. GOD is. if the bible is true, then u will have done what god wants. if it is not? god will decide. think about it, all your actions, your beliefs...do they stem from within you? or do they come from the holy bible? where does your faith lie?

 

The most important thing of the Old part of the bible is that so many places in the bible, the Birth and death of Jesus is fortold. Long before he was born Micha even told that he would be born in Bethlehem, and it just happend, after Maria and Joseph had to go to Bethlehem, while Maria was pregnant and Jesus was born there. That's just an example, the whole bible is full of things that happend later.

 

Allah is but another name for the same god.
Both religions are even based on the same book. Of course the presence of God doesn't mean that other gods can't exist. Or maybe all of them are the same. I remember an ancient egyptian prophecy that said all the gods would die and be reborn as one. Who knows?
The BIBLE says only believers go to heaven.
That's absurd. Where in the Bible does it say that?

 

Mathetais Post in this link says so. From Romans 2:5-14
http://www.sorcerers.net/ubb/Forum7/HTML/001023.html

 

Nobleman . . . welcome back! Hope you had a great summer vacation.

hmmm . . . it seems these "religious threads" always get back to one core idea. People don't want to believe in a God that has justice/wrath along with love.

Maybe we think that if ANYONE is going to hell, then *I* might be a part of that group . . . and it is far simpler to dismiss God and Hell than to grapple with it.

The question that started this thread was, "Is God Really Upstairs." We've gotten off that point by discussing the character of the God that we believe or don't believe exists. I think this is informative. I wonder that if Christianity taught a shallow, wrathless God if people would find him easier to believe in. However, if we taught that, then He wouldn't be WORTH believing in. What good is a God who allows every standard to be broken, every law shattered and every creation spoiled without demanding payment???

 

Devine, you are so wrong here. When you say Koran and the Bible are the same, you are totally wrong! They mean Allah and we mean God but there are so many differences. The most important one is that in the Islam you ahve to deserve Allah's mercy by doing good things, living good. We christians do good things not by ourselves but cause of the Holy Ghost, and the Holy Ghost is given us because of Christs death. The Islam doesn't even believe in Jesus as God, in their opninion he was just a good person, and they say Mohammed is much more important.

So they get mercy after doing good things.
We do good things because we got Mercy (by Jesus)

The Bible does say many times that you have to believe in Jesus to go to heaven.

free translated from how it is in the Dutch bible, there is a passage that says:

Everybody who who says with his mouth and believes with his heart that Jesus is Lord, he HAS life for eternity.

 

Everybody who who says with his mouth and believes with his heart that Jesus is Lord, he HAS life for eternity

And who decides what this means? can it not mean immortality, not going to heaven? i'm really curious here... who exactly tells us what the bible means by certain lines? or are we supposed to instinctively know? and if it is humans who "feel" that this passage means this... could it not be in err?

 

Is that so hard? The bible sais that when you believe in what Jesus did for you and tell others about that, you have eternal life. That means after you died you go to heaven, and you will live will CONTINUE (not restart) on the new earth.

 

I don't believe... Yet. My mind is a bit too "scientific". I fear the "enlightment" might never happen. So be it.

That aside I think I have found reason enough in all the "pro-religious" post to say that it's a very simple and logic system you have there. Once it is understood(does that make sense?). I am rambling? I guess I am. Just late in the evening. I'll better be a little passive in this post and see what Arkados gets going.

 

i am unreligious (please do not flame me about it), so i have few thoughts on the subject i am afraid.

[Um, then why did you post? - BTA]

[This message has been edited by Blackthorne TA (edited September 04, 2001).]

 

ok, that one was slightly straight-forward. but there are many other passages which might have meanings which people might interpret differently, and how do you know yours is the true interpretation? i shall conduct a poll on a new topic, for curiousity's sake.