1. SPS Accounts:
    Do you find yourself coming back time after time? Do you appreciate the ongoing hard work to keep this community focused and successful in its mission? Please consider supporting us by upgrading to an SPS Account. Besides the warm and fuzzy feeling that comes from supporting a good cause, you'll also get a significant number of ever-expanding perks and benefits on the site and the forums. Click here to find out more.
    Dismiss Notice
Dismiss Notice
You are currently viewing Boards o' Magick as a guest, but you can register an account here. Registration is fast, easy and free. Once registered you will have access to search the forums, create and respond to threads, PM other members, upload screenshots and access many other features unavailable to guests.

BoM cultivates a friendly and welcoming atmosphere. We have been aiming for quality over quantity with our forums from their inception, and believe that this distinction is truly tangible and valued by our members. We'd love to have you join us today!

(If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us. If you've forgotten your username or password, click here.)

D&D rules getting to complicated

Discussion in 'Dungeons & Dragons + Other RPGs' started by Merlanni, Jan 30, 2007.

  1. Merlanni

    Merlanni Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!)

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2005
    Messages:
    2,445
    Media:
    23
    Likes Received:
    54
    Gender:
    Male
    After reading some forum this thought occured to me. It was a debate over xp penalties. the person was a human druid and had two other classes on level one. He had the penalty after shapeshifting to a bear. The debate went on but left me with the question:

    Is it going to far? Are the rules getting so absurdly huge that gamemakers dedide not to use them? Is the treshold to high for new gamers?
     
  2. Register Gems: 29/31
    Latest gem: Glittering Beljuril


    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2001
    Messages:
    3,146
    Likes Received:
    1
    Gender:
    Male
    D20 is known for being extremely overcomplicated at simple things while entirely mainstreaming things that should have more rules. This is not news.

    So yeah, there is a serious threat from getting new players. I've had players getting bored with D20 after playing either a more realistic or more abstract game. D20 tries too hard to be something in between, which it fails horribly.

    If WotC didn't acquire licences for non-standard D20 settings, they'd go in the crapper so fast it isn't funny.
     
  3. Ilmater's Suffering Gems: 21/31
    Latest gem: Pearl


    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2006
    Messages:
    1,352
    Likes Received:
    4
    Apparently 4.0 is going out of it's way to make the game less complicated, at least for the DM. Yes, that's right, WotWC, despite their denials, is apparently working on 4.0.
     
  4. kuemper Gems: 31/31
    Latest gem: Rogue Stone


    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2005
    Messages:
    8,926
    Likes Received:
    8
    Okay, let's see if I got it right:

    A human druid multiclassed twice and the multiclasses are both at level 1? There should be no XP penalty. Humans get their highest class as their "favored" class and as long as the other 2 classes are within 1 level of each other, there is no penalty.

    DnD is based on whatever the players decide kind of rules. Everything is optional. My group decided prestige classes don't affect any XP penalty you might get.
     
  5. Blackthorne TA

    Blackthorne TA Master in his Own Mind Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2000
    Messages:
    10,410
    Media:
    40
    Likes Received:
    232
    Gender:
    Male
    The fact that prestige classes do not count towards determining XP penalties is part of the rules.
     
  6. Register Gems: 29/31
    Latest gem: Glittering Beljuril


    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2001
    Messages:
    3,146
    Likes Received:
    1
    Gender:
    Male
    BTA, I think that was changed in 3.5

    Or was it like it in 3.0, and then changed to no penalty in 3.5?
     
  7. Merlanni

    Merlanni Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!)

    Joined:
    Nov 12, 2005
    Messages:
    2,445
    Media:
    23
    Likes Received:
    54
    Gender:
    Male
    The multiclassing is easy. Even shapechanged. My point is not the penalty, my point is that it is discussed so proving that it make things complicated. I like 3.5 as it is, and take the time to figure it out.

    BG2 introduced me to D&D, and after that NWN1. I have bought the player handbook and monster manual to get more understanding of the rules.
     
  8. Gnarfflinger

    Gnarfflinger Wiseguy in Training

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2004
    Messages:
    5,423
    Likes Received:
    30
    D&D 3.0 came out in 2000. Even starting on 4.0, it won't likely ship until 2010. 10 years between paradigm shifts like that is not a huge problem...

    I think that the game expanded in ways they never envisioned 7 years ago. 4.0 would accommodate that...
     
  9. Faragon Gems: 25/31
    Latest gem: Moonbar


    Veteran

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2001
    Messages:
    2,015
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hehehe, he had a multiclassing experience penalty when he shifted out of his human shape (favoured class: any) into his bear shape? (no favoured class mentioned)

    There's no mention of multiclassing rules being applicable for a druid's wildshape ability, so they don't. :)

    But yes, the rules are overly complicated at times. Even with a group that consists of pretty much only DMs with several years of experience, we have to look up quite a few things each session.
     
  10. Fabius Maximus Gems: 19/31
    Latest gem: Aquamarine


    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2003
    Messages:
    1,103
    Likes Received:
    3
    People, stop making references to edition 4.0. That's only a rumor, and it can stay a rumor, if you ask me.
     
  11. Blackthorne TA

    Blackthorne TA Master in his Own Mind Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2000
    Messages:
    10,410
    Media:
    40
    Likes Received:
    232
    Gender:
    Male
    No, it's in both. It's just that it's mentioned in the Prestige Class section of the DMG and not in the Multiclassing section of the PHB.
     
Sorcerer's Place is a project run entirely by fans and for fans. Maintaining Sorcerer's Place and a stable environment for all our hosted sites requires a substantial amount of our time and funds on a regular basis, so please consider supporting us to keep the site up & running smoothly. Thank you!

Sorcerers.net is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to products on amazon.com, amazon.ca and amazon.co.uk. Amazon and the Amazon logo are trademarks of Amazon.com, Inc. or its affiliates.