BG II - newbie thoughts

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Beren is right. I don't mind someone saying they prefer Aerie to Nalia or that Imoen has better thieving skills because that does not reveal much about what is going to happen in the game.

Meanwhile, in this dungeon we have discovered a room where all that happens is you get asked a load of riddles. Crazy stuff.

And on the Imoen / Nalia topic. So far in this game I have concluded that fighters seem to be far more valuable than wizards. Minsc and Keldorn can handle 95% of all fights by themselves with Nalia, Arya, and Viconia just standing around waiting. At least Viconia is useful for healing and protection. Nalia's most commonly used spell is Haste so there hardly seems any need to have two wizards. We'll see.

 

HB, that's why I usually go with a tank-heavy party. Although once you get to ToB, an extra mage can come in handy once in awhile, but they're more useful if they are good in melee as well. That's one reason why I like Blades; they don't have access to spells above level 6 (other than through scrolls), but one high-level mage is enough for me. (Haer'Dalis is a Blade, but I don't believe you've rescued him yet.)

 

Agreed. I generally go for a tank heavy party as well. Even more so in ToB, however. Maybe that's just from a habit of taking a Tank Heavy Party in SoA, but I always find my mages slinging bullets and doing very little.
Priests, though! Priests are always essential!
Perhaps Imoen, Aerie, and Viconia would be a good idea, rather than Imoen, Nalia, and Viconia. Swapping Aerie for Nalia would give you 1 full mage, 1 full cleric, and a cleric/mage. Seems more balanced.

 

Tanks may be able to handle almost everything but they are so boring to play! No tactics at all, just point and click. I like lots of mages so there is something for me as a player to do during the fights. If you concentrate on your mages as much as you do on your tanks you will find that the fights tend to end before your tanks can close with the enemy. All classes are powerful if used correctly. In my first runs I used my tanks almost exclusively as well with my mage just hanging back and tossing the occasional magic missile now I tend to barrage my enemies with spells and then just let the fighters mop up what is left. At least I find that more fun as you get to use and see all manner of cool spells.

 

I guess I haven't figured out all the efficient ways of using the spells. The only ones Nalia ever uses are: Chromatic Orb, Magic Missile, Haste, Mirror Image, and Dispel Magic. Usually by the time she has cast one or two spells, Keldorn and Minsc have killed the enemy already. Plus they don't have to rest every time to get their sword fighting abilities back.

 

Geoff and HB have summed up perfectly the reasons I don't like/use spells that much. I'm also not crazy about having to micro-manage a lot of party members, which you have to do with spellcasters. Plus, like HB, I don't really have a great grasp on how to use spells.

joacqin, on the other had, suggests an appoach that hadn't really occurred to me before - hold back the tanks at first (rather than sending them straight into battle), let the spellcasters soften up the enemy, and then let the tanks do clean-up. While this would still involve some micro-management, it could make things a bit more interesting. Hmm, and I was just starting to think about my next party...

 

Riddle me this riddle me that, whos afraid of the big bad bat!?! Are you getting tired of this dungeon yet or are you coping with all the crazyiness?

I did find when I played my first game I choose too many wizards and clerics and the party wasnt strong enough, you definately need that extra fighter here and there, I find the mages only come in useful against... ohh you havent got there yet have you, I don't wanna give the game away do I?

So whats going down on the expo front? I thought you said it was just a FEW thousand to go untill you levelled up? *sigh*

 

Hooray. Arya has finally got her kensai abilities back (after we found a book that kept producing harder monsters and more XP). Now she is quite awesome because she can sneak ahead with her cloak of non-detection, lay traps, backstab for 100 points of damage, run back through the traps for even more damage. Sometimes the others don't have to do anything.

Only problem with that strategy is that it only seems to work on weaker enemies that Minsc and Keldorn could defeat anyway. The hard enemies seem to either be immune to backstab and/or seem to be able to see her when she is hidden.

Her ThAC0 is now -2 so she is easily the best melee fighter in the team (so long as the enemy is attacking someone else as her AC is not the best - especially after losing that point of Dexterity in the dream).

 

Why'd you sacrifice Dex. when you could have sacrificed Wisdom or Intelligence? Or constitution.
And what enemies are you referring to that can see her when hidden and that are immune to backstab?

 

liches obviously

 

yeah, I must admit for a fighter thief dex would be the last thing to loose out on... don't suppose you have a backup save anywhere...?

 

Oh, come on! It's called roleplaying! The game is more than beatable with any character, so long as you have a party for backup. Losing one point of Dex isn't exactly what you want, but it's not going to screw up your game, either.

 

Whats her AC now then? Now that she is buffed up, are you thinking of bringing down the number of people in your party?

 

And I doubt that any thief with an intelligence over 5 would sacrifice dexterity, given a choice.
(I'm not saying you have an intelligence below 5, HB, I'm saying losing dexterity doesn't make much roleplaying sense.)

 

Why not? I mean, here's Arya losing part of her divine essence during the course of a dream, and you think it's good roleplaying that she have the presence (and foreknowledge etc) to min-max herself? Looking back at my own dreams, I can't say my choices in the dreams have always been the most rational ones.

And come on people, have we become such powergamers that a thief PC (let alone a kensai dual class) with a Dex of 17 seems unplayable?

Actually, if there have been any problems with HBs roleplaying of Arya, they've had much more to do with the way she's handled NPCs. I mean, letting Anomen go like that, when it's so obvious that Arya had *huge* crush on him...

 

Well, Charname is focused in that dream. Comon, she can defeat Bhaal, she is very focused in the dream. It's not like a hazey dream where you aren't really in good control of yourself.
So, given that she's that focused, I think she should be able to make a logcal choice about which part of her she should sacrifice.

 

There are plenty of factors at play in this "sacrifice" scenario, so we don't have to fall back on "senseless choice." The most important are probably self-perception and value judgments. Someone may be a genius, but that doesn't mean they will cling to that gift and treasure it above all others. What if Arya's great agility is not that important to her, like a talent that she takes for granted? Or that she doesn't mind sacrificing? Or perhaps she just values her health and wisdom more, parts of herself she would like to better. Flip that around: what if Arya feels that for it to be a true sacrifice, it must be the most treasured part of herself? Anyway, there is plenty of depth to the role-playing perspective that goes way beyond the min-maxing mindset of Geoff.

 

Eric Xanthus - you have it pretty much right. At the time we had no idea that this was going to be a permanent loss of an ability score. We thought it might have been some sort of 'test' or a temporary thing just for the dream. and then "youth" seemed like the thing that you would sacrifice because you'd still want your intelligence and wisdom and health. In hindsight it was possibly the worst stat to sacrifice (given her AC situation) but didn't know that at the time.

Geoff - vampiric mists seemed to be able to detect Arya when hidden

Bion - Arya didn't deliberately let Anomen go - he ran off claiming to be too angry to carry on.

Slayer - Arya's unbuffed AC is 4, compared to Viconia's which is -8. Unless she is barkskinned or Improved Invisible or Mirror Imaged (using a magic short sword she has) then it is essential that she is not the one who is the target of enemy attacks.

 

I have never played kensai - what exactly are the armor limitations? Are they allowed anything in the style of rings and necklaces? If so, there's a few which could help to lower her AC...

 

unless you are trying to keep those rings and other AC improving items for your characters who you will send in first, and barkskinning Arya if she ever does get in a bit of a tussle.