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Assisted Suicide

Discussion in 'Alley of Dangerous Angles' started by Taluntain, May 6, 2011.

  1. Taluntain

    Taluntain Resident Alpha and Omega Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    I'm going to copy this from the Discworld Monthy newsletter to get the ball rolling:

    I don't really see assisted suicide as a big deal, personally... if you've unlucky enough to be afflicted by a debilitating disease that makes living insufferable, I think that it should be possible for you to choose to end your life in a legal way. Of course, what exactly would qualify as severe enough of an affliction to qualify for assisted suicide is the big question here.
     
  2. Barmy Army

    Barmy Army Simple mind, simple pleasures... Adored Veteran

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    [​IMG]
     
  3. LKD Gems: 31/31
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    I believe I had a thread on a similar topic a while back. IIRC, the philosopher David Hume wrotevin favor of choosing when you die, though I have not read his work myself. I myself am not a fan of useless, pointless suffering, and so in one sense I am in favor of the idea. It goes against my natural respect for the sanctity of life, though.
     
  4. Death Rabbit

    Death Rabbit Straight, no chaser Adored Veteran Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    I'm a confirmed proponent of assisted suicide if the following conditions are met: 1) the person is dying from a terminal illness with a remote to nil chance of recovery (so they're going to die before their time anyway), 2) the person is of sound mind (so they know full well what they are asking for), 3) the person is suffering from a permanent and irreversible condition that causes them extreme pain and/or discomfort, and 4) if available treatments to manage the aforementioned conditions are prohibitively expensive and would serve to do little more than lay a financially crushing burden on family members. And of course, 5) they are physically unable to take their own life.

    To die with dignity and on your own terms is a right everyone should have. To be able to end the suffering of a loved one when they themselves cannot and all but beg you to do it for them is one of the greatest expressions of love, IMO. I think Dr. Kavorkian is a hero.
     
  5. henkie

    henkie Hammertime Resourceful Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!)

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    Is assisted suicide in this context any different from euthanasia? Either way I agree that it should be a viable option available to people provided some conditions are met (DR's points 1 through 3, mostly). Keeping people alive for as long as possible without ever considering their quality of life is something that has always bothered me. Who wants to grow old if your every living moment is agony?
     
  6. 8people

    8people 8 is just another way of looking at infinite ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran

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    [​IMG] One is a medical procedure, which is pretty much what DR outlined.

    Assisted suicide is taking your own life with the help of someone else outside of a prearranged medical agreement. Though there are still assisted suicides in hospitals between doctors/nurses and patients.

    I'm uncertain where I stand on the issue, personally it does seem right that someone should they choose to end this life has the option to do so with the assistance they need without leaving those they love on the wrong side of the law. I guess there is also an appeal of arranging it as well so you can have the people you want around you, 'make a day of it' so to speak and not be alone.
     
  7. Silvery

    Silvery I won't pretend to be your friend coz I'm just not ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran

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    I agree with DR. It should be allowed but with strict criteria to avoid people taking advantage (ie. You can't kill off aunty Mary just because she broke her hip and you like the look of her best china)
     
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    My mother died a horrible death from lung cancer (she was a smoker). After seeing the pain and suffering she went through over the nine months it took her die it really helps you understand this issue. My dad and I have discussed this numerous times and we have both come to the conclusion that it is a mercy, and if either one of us were ever on a jury we could never convict someone for it no matter what the law or judge says we are supposed to.
     
  9. Morgoroth

    Morgoroth Just because I happen to have tentacles, it doesn'

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    I don't really understand why euthanasia is not a bigger issue politically. As the Finnish population grows older this issue really should increase in importance but as of yet it has little to no lobbying. Personally I'm all for it but would limit it to only cases where death is imminent and euthanasia would only quicken the inevitable. It also should be a very careful and thought out process which should rather be decided too slowly than too quickly.
     
  10. joacqin

    joacqin Confused Jerk Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Who should do the killing Morgoth? Should we demand that doctors now kill people as part of their job? However merciful it may be it is a great burden to put on someone.
     
  11. Death Rabbit

    Death Rabbit Straight, no chaser Adored Veteran Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    That's why it shouldn't be required of anyone, or left up to any one person. It should only happen when the doctor, family member and patient are in agreement. Or, if the patient cannot agree (and will never be physically able to agree), then it's left up to the doctor and nearest relative or spouse.
     
  12. joacqin

    joacqin Confused Jerk Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Someone would still have to supply the "assist". This is basically my only problem with both euthanesia and assisted suicide. Someone has to do the deed so to speak.
     
  13. Death Rabbit

    Death Rabbit Straight, no chaser Adored Veteran Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    I agree, which is why the physician must be involved. If the doctor is willing and agrees it is necessary, I don't see a problem. They would have the training and equipment necessary to painlessly and efficiently end the patient's life. We trust our doctors to risk our lives during surgery. I'd trust them to end lives as well.
     
  14. joacqin

    joacqin Confused Jerk Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    And you think the doctors would be ok with killing people?
     
  15. Blades of Vanatar

    Blades of Vanatar Vanatar will rise again Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Some would. Some won't. But if you are in a position that you want the assist, you go to a doctor that will assist. Simple.
     
  16. 8people

    8people 8 is just another way of looking at infinite ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran

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    [​IMG] Some would, some wouldn't. It's hardly uncommon for doctors to refuse to perform certain procedures.
     
  17. Morgoroth

    Morgoroth Just because I happen to have tentacles, it doesn'

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    I don't really see the problem. Not all doctors need to be willing to perform the procedure. I'm fairly sure that all doctors are not forced to perform abortions either. I'm quite certain that there won't be shortage of people willing to do the service, especially when there's potential monetary gain involved.
     
  18. T2Bruno

    T2Bruno The only source of knowledge is experience Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Mengele didn't have a problem with it.
     
  19. Death Rabbit

    Death Rabbit Straight, no chaser Adored Veteran Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    I can tell you from both personal and professional experience* that the number of doctors out there who know full well there's nothing they can do for certain patients except artificially prolong their lives/suffering – and wished it were legal for them to aid their patients in speeding the inevitable along – would likely surprise some of you. Doctors expressing their frustration at having to keep miserable patients alive for months and even years with no hope of improving their quality of life is quite common.

    There are plenty of doctors out there who'd be willing to assist were it legal and a sanctioned practice by the AMA. I wouldn't say they are a majority, as many would have moral reservations about it, obviously – but they're definitely a sizable group.

    * I worked in an ER in college, and my mother was an ER nurse before she retired, so not only have I been in and around hospitals my entire life, I've gotten to know quite a few doctors and nurses on a personal basis.
     
  20. T2Bruno

    T2Bruno The only source of knowledge is experience Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    True DR, I've known a few people who were terminally ill where the amount of medication in a prescription was in excess of a "lethal dose" of that particular medication and the doctor went out of his or her way to ensure the patient knew exactly how much would be lethal.
     
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