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1 in 5 Americans STILL think Obama is a Muslim

Discussion in 'Alley of Lingering Sighs' started by Aldeth the Foppish Idiot, Aug 19, 2010.

  1. Merlanni

    Merlanni ★ SPS Account Holder Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!)

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  2. Harbourboy

    Harbourboy Take thy form from off my door! Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    No - it's just another label we use to group people together unnecessarily so we can generalise about them. If he's a Muslim, then that MUST mean he's trying to blow up America, so someone had better shoot him!
     
  3. Drew

    Drew Arrogant, contemptible, and obnoxious Adored Veteran

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    In the United States? Sadly, yes. Remember, it was a "big deal" when we elected JFK in 1960, and he was just catholic. Legal or not, there is a religious test when it comes to holding the highest office in this country.
     
  4. Ragusa

    Ragusa Eternal Halfling Paladin Veteran

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    Snook, they did that. It's just that the doubters are simply just irreconcilable.
     
  5. The Great Snook Gems: 31/31
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    I don't agree with you on this. While I'm sure someone who is a big fan of Obama and all of his policies may feel this way, people who have differing opinions (be they wildly or only slightly different) will require more proof. As I said in my response to Chandos this is a smoke equals fire situation. The more things he does that appear Muslimish will convince more and more people that he is one. I'm not aware of anything that he has done that would be considered "Christian".

    I'm sure to people that this type of stuff is important it can be very concerning. The fact that I would probably have to go to Temple every week is reason enough for me to not go into politics.
     
  6. Chandos the Red

    Chandos the Red This Wheel's on Fire

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    What would you consider an example of doing something "Christian?"

    Are you backtracking? I thought those "Muslimish" things were factual errors. Are you flip-flopping on me, Snook?
     
  7. NOG (No Other Gods)

    NOG (No Other Gods) Going to church doesn't make you a Christian

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    He tried to give proof that he was a Christian during his campaign, but it didn't really work. Most Christians don't accept 'there are many ways to God' as a Christian belief.
     
  8. Chandos the Red

    Chandos the Red This Wheel's on Fire

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    Do you mean "didn't work" with the people who voted for him (of which there were more), or those who did not? Those who didn't vote for him didn't really give a damn anyway, so what's your point?
     
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    As to the first question, being seen going into a church every Sunday would work. Other than that I will have to defer to our Chirstian board members as I have no idea.

    As to the second, no flip flop at all. Just because I believe them to not all be true, doesn't mean that they are false. The reason they are an anchor to him is because they sound true or have some partial truths to them that resonates with people. You are looking at this through the eyes of an "Obama fanboy". If you look at it from the position of a skeptic you will easily see how people can draw other conclusions.
     
  10. Harbourboy

    Harbourboy Take thy form from off my door! Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    It's quite astounding that this should matter at all. I have no idea what religion, if any, New Zealand's Prime Minister is. I doubt if anyone in New Zealand cares.
     
  11. Chandos the Red

    Chandos the Red This Wheel's on Fire

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    Really? So just showing up at a church proves someone is a Christian, like the mafia lords who show up at church on Sunday and shoot people during the week? :hmm:

    Are we speaking of the facts? They can be checked, so yes, it does mean that.

    You can stop the mindless insults. You have yet to prove your "truths," while I have shown them to be pretty much what they are - false.

    For one thing you commented that Obama's "dad is a Muslim." You didn't even no he was no longer alive and that he spent much of his life and ended his life as an atheist.

    You said, "Obama spent his childhood in a Muslim country," which was a lie - he spent four years there.

    Then you offered as your "proof" that he attended a church which had a history of attmepting to convert black muslims to Christianity. That's some great proof you have there. Of course along the way you just happened to throw in that it was a "racist" church, but at the same time you "insisted" that you were not "mocking."

    Then you commented as "proof" that relations with Israel were the "worst in a generation," which you have not been able to prove. Or even how that IS "proof."

    That would be me, since I attend a Christian church, with a lot of people who also voted for Obama. Yes, we are Christians who voted for Obama and who believe he is a fellow Christian.

    That, sir, you have proven. ;)
     
  12. Ragusa

    Ragusa Eternal Halfling Paladin Veteran

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    I disagree. IMO it is innuendo from people like Franklin Graham that makes the theme 'Obama is a secret Muslim' stick:
     
  13. Barmy Army

    Barmy Army Simple mind, simple pleasures... Adored Veteran

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    It really does boggle the mind to be honest... what's the big furore about?
     
  14. joacqin

    joacqin Confused Jerk Veteran

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    When I first heard about some up and coming black American politician that was supposedly a muslim a few years ago I was very excited. It would mean so much if someone like that could actually go places in the US but then I found out that it was only a smear campaign that had labelled Obama as a muslim and things were back to normal.
     
  15. NOG (No Other Gods)

    NOG (No Other Gods) Going to church doesn't make you a Christian

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    Umm, Ragusa, my only comment on the bit you quoted (and I know it wasn't you who was saying this) is that he also has a Jewish name. Does that make him Jewish?

    Chandos, every Christian I've talked to who heard the bit of his interview where he said that has told me that, at best, they think he believes himself a Christian, but they don't really think he is. Of course, I'll leave the final distinction to God, but as I said, the 'many ways to God' line isn't generally considered to be in-line with Christian beliefs (especially the "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man comes to the Father, but by me" bit).
     
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    @Chandos

    I'm not trying to prove anything. All I did was post some of the more common things that the general public knows about Obama that could lead people to believe he is a Muslim. Whether they are true or not they have a "sound" of truth.

    Making claims that his father is dead and was a more of an atheist in his adult life doesn't change the fact that he was born a Muslim. Therefore the statement that his father was a Muslim is accurate. The same can be said for most of the other things I posted. I believe I said he spent his childhood in Indonesia. Well the ages of 6-10 fall into the period that most people would consider "childhood" The fact that it was only 4 years doesn't make it a falsehood, it may be an exaggeration, but isn't not true.

    It wouldn't take a lot of hard work to swing this back the other way. As I said, he needs to be more public about his worship. It probably wouldn't hurt to spend some time with the Graham kid that Ragusa posted about. Show up at that guy's church and meet with him and his flock. Quote a couple of passages once in a while and the Christians would fall back in line.
     
  17. Chandos the Red

    Chandos the Red This Wheel's on Fire

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    NOG - The debate is not about what kind of Christian he is but if he is a Muslim, and it's a fool's game to start judging another man by your personal choice and standards of theology (anyone can pick and chose Bible passages). Of course orthodox, fundamentalist churches are going to claim that Obama must stand up and recite Bible verses to the public before they, in their smug and self-righteous judgments can proclaim that he passes "their test" for being Christian, which would also include a national ban on abortion and gay marriage and that we are at war with "Islam." How nice for them. Those types weren't going to vote for him anyway, not when they can vote their little minds and little hearts for Sarah until the End Times.


    You can continue to ignore the fact that many Christians did vote for him - and believe him to believe one of us. However, it only makes you appear more partisan, especially while you keep spouting that "Christians" doubt Obama, unless of course you believe that the 90 percent of black voters who voted for him can't be "Christians" as well. You are, of course, refering to the "Christian," rightwing conservatives, and there are many of us who can only guess some of the other inane things they also believe to be "facts" about Obama.

    Really?

    Also, leaving out that Obama's father was an atheist within this context is willful ignorance (too lazy to bother with the facts), or is lying by omision.



    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Childhood
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2010
  18. The Great Snook Gems: 31/31
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    Really?



    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Childhood[/QUOTE]

    This is what I'm talking about. You are focusing on the trees and not seeing the forest. Factually, 6-10 doesn't encompass someone's entire childhood and you are 100% accurate, but it is a period that everyone agrees happens in childhood and therefore the statement is legitimate. Arguing the semantics and definitions doesn't change that most people will see some truth to the statement that he spent his childhood in Indonesia which is primarily a Muslim nation.
     
  19. Chandos the Red

    Chandos the Red This Wheel's on Fire

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    Sorry, that statement doesn't make any sense.
     
  20. Blackthorne TA

    Blackthorne TA Master in his Own Mind Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Maybe it would be better if the statement was "...spent a portion of his childhood...". I don't think the phrase "spent one's childhood" is normally taken literally to mean one's entire childhood unless the word "entire" is included in the phrase.

    Not that I think it matters :)
     
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