Yet Another Newbie Needing Party Help

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Hi folks, I'm a longtime lurker and avid BG2 player that finally decided to pick up IWD2. Normally I just make a character and roll with it my first time through, but I seriously boned myself in NWN due to not really getting the byzantine multiclass rules in 3E. (I have played 2E PnP for 10+ years and can't be bothered with 3E) I know enough from years of gaming that certain people should have certain roles in the group, and am trying for a good balance between melee strength and magic. But I would appreciate any suggestions.

My usual playing style: in PnP I am a hardcore RPer and have no use for munchkin PCs, but in cRPGs I try to strike a balance. I choose races based solely on RP preference and regardless of how it affects gameplay: I adore elves (esp. drow), hate dwarves, and think humans are boring as all get out. Classes I am flexible about, unless I have character concept that absolutely demands a particular class. OTOH, I want my group to be able to hold its own against whatever challenges it may face--I don't need to obliterate my foes where they stand to have a good time (it is nice on occasion ), but I would rather not get creamed and have to reload 80 times. For my first time I would like to try approximate my current PnP party. Here's what I had in mind:

-Kariza de'Camyras: CG Drow Ranger/Cleric (healer/scout/stealth-finesse fighter)
-Sion Taranduil: CN Elven Fighter/Mage (melee/spell support)
-Daeron Anawamane: CG Elven Fighter (straight up melee)
-Naeron Anawamane: CG Elven Rogue/Mage (scout/ranged attacker)
-Michiru Kisaragi: LG Aasimar Paladin (tank--which deities would be good for this, and suitable for a woman who is a samurai?)
-Niki Pharsalos: NG Half-Elven Bard/Sorcerer (all-around support guy)

Now for some questions. The obvious one would be how to distribute the levels among the multiclass PCs. I'm most concerned about Kariza and Niki: Kariza, in PnP, is a Ranger/Sword Dancer of Eilistraee so I was thinking of making her a Ranger/Cleric of Selune since there's no non-human gods in this game and AFAIK there's no mod with Eilistraee. Is that even possible or would I have to make her a generic Cleric (yuck!) or single class her? I've also been reading that rangers majorly suck in this game, how is Ranger/Cleric as an option? Will I get my behind kicked?

I have also heard that bards are mediocre, but I would rather not change that bit of Niki's character because being a bard is really intrinsic to who he is (he is the bastard son of a king who was abandoned for political reasons, and ended up being taken in by a very musical kumpania of gypsies). The sorcerer part is to reflect his psionic abilities but I can ditch those if it looks like I have too many multi PCs (which I suspect is the case).

One last thing...I was also thinking of doing a party of good drow (Kariza and some friends of mixed classes from her temple) as an alternative. Is that feasible with the XP penalties? I have an idea about how it works on paper in 3E but I'm curious to know if anyone has done it (or a full party of other penalized races) and the actual effect it has on the game.

I really enjoy the boards and am looking forward to posting some more.

 

Interesting stuff. Points to note are:
1) Rangers are under-powered in IWD II but maybe not enough to get your behind kicked.
2) Your party is a missing an out-and-out spellcaster with enough levels to get to the high level powerful spells quickly.
3) ECL penalties are negligble in the long-run and are offset by that races special powers.
4) Give Karisa 1 level of Ranger at most and the rest in Cleric.
5) Paladin deities only really matter if you're going to multi-class. For pure Paladins they have no real effect. A samurai would choose Helm.

 

1 level of Ranger is enough, this will give you Amberdexterity & Two-Weapon Fighting, meaning good candidate for dual weilding small blades. Also add Weapon Finesse feat and max out the dexterity for this character.

4 levels of Fighter will give you weapon specialization. I wouldn't add more than 4 levels of Fighter because then you'll start losing out on higher level spells. In a normal game, a 6 member party with no ECL penalties should reach around 16/17 level. So you might want to keep this in mind when deciding where/when to multiclass your characters.

Since you have a single class Paladin in your party, I would consider dropping this character. Dropping down to 5 characters will increase your xp throughout the game.

Take at least 2 levels of Rogue so that you can aquire Evasion. 3 levels will give you 1d6 backstab ability, but it's not necessary since this character is going to be mostly ranged character.

I agree with Harbourboy, make her a Paladin of Helm.

I've read that single class Sorcerers are pretty awesome and can hold their own with the right spell selection. I've never used a Bard (don't care for them personally) so I can't really give you any advice other than they can't sing a song and cast a spell at the same time. However, you already have 2 mages mixed with another Cleric, you might could even drop this character as well and just use a party of 4.

 

A Paladin 1 (or 2)/Sorceror would be much better than a Bard/Sorceror (these three classes rely on CHA). It's always nice to have a Sorceror around for extra firepower (I have misgivings about the Fighter/Mage)

 

Thanks for the suggestions everyone, they're all really helpful. I would really rather go with a full party of 6, at least until I get the nuances of the 3E system. I may end up dropping one or two down the line once I get the hang of it and it looks like I'm doing alright.

I guess I should just stop micromanaging and play the freakin' game already, hehe.

 

Let me get this out of the way, too many damned do-gooders in your party

Ranger[1]/Cleric[x]. You have to choose a deity to follow.
IWD II does not have any generic version of Priest. Ilmater or Tempus if she is good and Talos or Mask if she is evil.
Fighter[2] will give you 2 extra feats, if you find yourself short.
Barbarian[1] will give you extra speed if wearing light or medium armour. May come in handy when you have to HEAL someone.

Fighter[4]/Wizard[x]. This guy could also be a Drow, that would work beautifully. Melee: yeah hell.

Would you consider a HalfOrc Fighter[4]/Barbarian[x] with maxed out strength instead?

You mean the classic Rouge[2]/Wizard[x]? With maxed out Int and Dex he does everything except carry your armour for you.

Fighter[4]Paladin of Helm[x] or Palaldin of Helm[3]/Fighter[x].

Human would actually be better here, but its your act.

Sion is redundant, loose him. Add a straight Sorcerer instead.
If Nearon is going to be your high AC decoy, then drop either Daeron or Michiru. If he attacks from range then keep them both.

 

Hee! Like I said, I'm re-recreating my current PnP party. I can't help it if they're all goody two-shoes. I do want to try an all-evil party eventually, just for the heck of it. Sometimes you just gotta murder and pillage, ya know?

Race is totally non-negotiable on these characters. I don't mind taking a too big of a hit because of it, either. It's just who they are. The idea of Sion as a drow is pretty comical, actually. Drow raiding party killed his whole family and burned the village to the ground.

Naeron's a range attacker. Although she is dumb enough to be a decoy, if you gave her a cookie or something (that's what 6 wis will get you ). Is a high AC decoy the same thing as a tank, or would I need both? I guess I'm confused cause Michi was gonna be the tank and I was going to try to put her AC as high as possible (heavy armor, shield, etc).

 

The various suggestions here would improve the power of your party but as it stands they should still be able to do OK. You'll just have to find the tactics that work for this group.

 

Thanks, I don't want to seem ungrateful or anything, cause I really appreciate the suggestions. I just wanted to know if they were going to be smears on the carpet regardless of what I did (like what happened to me in NWN, lol).

I really am going to go play the game now! Honest!

 

Tactics is always the key to a good battle.

AC decoy, is someone that sneaks in, makes an attack (typically a backstab) and then runs causing the enemies to follow. Once the decoy makes it back to where you want to fight, your other guys/gals jump in and cut/blast'em to hades and you move on to the next group.

One of the things that I like most about IWD 1 & 2 is the ability to drag monster to where you want to fight so that you can use the terrain to your advantage instead of walking into a death trap. I always Hide my Rogue and have her scout ahead. Once I find trouble, I'll bring her back, position everyone and then play out my plan of attack. There is nothing better than a barrier between you and them where they are forced down a small path where a couple of Web spells are casted so you can do some damage before the brawl gets started Ugh...I need to go home and play...too much work not enough IWD....feeling lightheaded, need an IWD fix....

 

Tanks generally have so many HPs that they can take more than a few knocks and still remain standing, while at the same time severing heads in melee fury. They are sometimes forced to sacrifice a few points of AC in order to enhance their melee capasity.

Decoys on the other hand need not do a lot of damage meleewise but must have a very high AC to survive in the midst of enemy fire. Their damage mainly comes from spells.

Naeron gets 6Wis? Sure hope she doesn't get charmed all the time as then the bad guys will forget her and come after the rest of the party.

 

Nah, I meant she has 6 wis in PnP. I'm willing to fudge that for the game...tabletop it makes for funny situations, like the time she bought a ringworm for 1000 gp from a guy named Sleazenose 'cause he told her it was a Ring of Protection +2. But in the game I fudged it higher 'cause I really didn't want to deal with the charming issue.

I played through the prologue last night. I ended up pretty much going with what I intended, except I gave Niki 1 bard level and then making him a sorcerer. That went fine, but I found myself running into trouble when I ran into Torak (Torak as an orc? Too funny if you're a Dave Eddings geek). I learned the hard way not to rely on the AI scripts as much as I did in BG2. Is it just me or are they unbelievably stupid? Michi kept switching to crossbow for no freaking reason (I had her use the Guardian script) and got Sion killed. I'm gonna try it again but this time I'm not gonna be lazy about it.

Thanks for the AC clarification. I gave Naeron 2 rogue levels as was suggested and the rest will be wizard. I will be sure to give her all the good AC stuff.

Quick load finger getting itchy, bbl.

 

I don't trust the AI scripts at all. That's one of the reasons why I like a small party. It's easier to micro-manage. I'm more of a pause freek during battles so that it's easier to manage as well. I've also changed the Auto-Pause feature to initiate whenever someone has an uneffective weapon. There's nothing like getting into a huge battle with one character hacking on a major baddie and because of all the action going on you miss that your character can't hit Mr. Baddie, atleast until you switch to a different weapon

 

Vassago - I agree. In a big battle you could easily miss the fact that one of your chars is swiping at the air.

 

I'm with you on the pausing. I have it set to pause on everything, and I'm doing everything myself this time--doing MUCH better now.

I'm having a different kind of problem now, though. I'm on the quest in Ch. 1 where you have to save the villagers from Torak's orcs. I met whatsherface (Kristin?) and had Naeron sneak into the camp, clicked on the wheel, etc. Backtracked and killed all the orcs no problem. But the villagers are just standing around. I broke all the barrels, went and killed Torak and every last orc in the camp, etc. But it's still not moving forward. Am I overlooking something completely obvious here?

 

What do the villagers say when you talk to them? Do they thank you? What does whatsherface say when you talk to her?

 

The villagers all say stuff like "why aren't you freeing us?" etc. And whatsherface says "is there anything I can help you with?" or something like that, and the only option is to say nope, goodbye.

It's really bugging me, especially since I screwed up and saved over my last save by accident, and if I'm stuck I will have to do Tar-blows for what will be the 3rd time.

 

What a pain. Are you sure there isn't a morale failed Orc hiding in the bushes somewhere that you haven't killed yet?

 

I uncovered the whole map, so I'm not sure. I'm gonna give it one last pixel-by-pixel sweep. And if it doesn't work I'm gonna curl up under the desk in the fetal position.

This game is driving me crazy.

 

I've never heard of that problem before. I thought we'd heard them all by now.