Totally new, aimed at HOF mode, powergaming party

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Please let me know what you think of this one:

Character 1: Male Drow Rogue 3/Fighter 4/Barbarian 3/ Illusionist X

This is my scout, and a melee type for most of the regular game. The Illusionist levels are only for HoF mode, but I might be able to add a few in regular mode as well. I don't plan on having this character be heavily armored, but I like the idea of him weilding a greatsword and really putting the hurt on some bad guys. He'll pour his skills into the stealthy types. Evasion, Uncanny Dodge, and some defensive spells will make him a great scout also. I'll concentrate on buff-type spells with this character only. Alternative: If I choose to dual-weild, I could add 3 Ranger levels also. I'd almost definitely not be able to add Illusionist levels until HoF mode then.

Character 2: Shield Dwarf Battleguard of Tempus X

This is my main Cleric, and will also double as a great tank. She is based on a PnP character of mine, and I really love her!

Character 3: Aasimar Paladin 2/Cleric of Lathander X

This is my backup Cleric, and will be a pretty good tank as well weilding the Holy Avenger sword. I don't plan on adding the Paladin levels until late in the game, so that I can establish this characters power as a spellcaster first. I also know I need to take both Cleric levels sequentially, since you can't multiclass this Cleric class with any Paladin order. I just really like the Lathander offensive spell special abilities.

Character 4: Human Sorcerer X

This is my main arcane spellcaster. If these guys are anything like they are in BG2, I'm sure to really love them!

Character 5: Drow Rogue 2/Conjuror 25/Bard 3

This is my backup spellcaster. I plan on playing him as my lock handler, trap finder, pocket picker, and loremaster as well. The Bard levels would be added only after the character was (at least) Rogue 1/Conjuror 20. With the Lingering Song feat, he could sing one of the first two songs and for a round when not casting. It's also possible I'll just go Rogue 2/Conjuror 28.

Character 6: Human Monk 1/Druid X.

This character offers a different type of divine magic, and can be a very good fighter while shapeshifted.

I'm also considering a Deep Gnome Monk-type character here. I've heard a good decoy is important in HoF mode, and these guys look like they'd be great at the job. I'm not sure about how I'd go about multiclassing him though.

Another idea is a Drow Bard 11/Druid 19 (or 12/18). This character would get to Bard 11 (or 12) and pretty much squat from there. The Druid spells are just icing on the cake for later. I wouldn't worry too much about this guy because he'll be far in the back and out of combat.


Final Thoughts:

First of all, I'd like to state that it was intentionaly that I added more ECL races to this party, but kept care to make sure that my main spellcasters were "pureclassed" and to be at the maximum level possible.

I'm also really not set on character 6 yet. I've got thoughts of adding a Paladin 1/Sorcerer there (do you get two Holy Avengers if you play HoF mode after regular mode, or do you lose your items?), and I'm also open to suggestions. I really hate reloading all of the time, which is why I'm so insistent on "getting it right" the first time.

Also, I'm not all that familiar with the specialist Mages in this game. Am I choosing appropriate specialty schools?

EDIT: Added the Druid/Bard option for character 6.

[ January 13, 2007, 04:29: Message edited by: Klorox ]

 

The druid/bard won't probably reach high enough AC to work efficiently as a decoy. Read the jupp found here in SP if you want to use a decoy, otherwise you can just use him as a druid with some extra ac in normal mode and useful spells in HOF. He has some summon-capabilities in HOF which is almost a must if going without decoy.

Edit: BTW your party should do fine in HOF!! Well balanced with lots of spell power!

[ January 13, 2007, 13:00: Message edited by: Mudde ]

 

I wouldn't add ranger levels. If you want to dual wield 4 levels of fighter should be enough to have two feats to spare on two weapons fighting and ambidexterity.

Adding just one ranger level can be effective for some builds (especially finesse characters) otherwise fighter levels are much better.

 

I'd give a paladin level to the sorcerer, so you get the permanent stat raises for finding the holy avenger twice. (normal + HOF mode)
Casters don't gain much more after level 20.

 

Kmonster, stat increases are nice and all, but are they REALLY worth losing a level of sorceror?

Arguably, a better class combo for squeaking out those bene's might be a Pally of Ilmater 1 or 2/Cleric of Ilmater X. That way, any WIS bonuses would be going into a stat that really helps out the character's primary spellcasting stat. Just a thought, and not really relevant to Klorox's interesting group.

 

In the end you'll be a little bit better by taking the pal lvl early to get the stat increases but a minor addition in str and wis won't do much good for a sorc and the lost lvl will make it a little harder in normal mode and the beginning of HOF. It's your choice if it's worth it.
I usually have my sorc as the party talker and don't always remember where you get rewards so I prefer to keep him/her away from pal lvls.

 

The character is also getting the saving throw bonuses, weapon proficiencies (martial weapon: bow), and the ability to use the Holy Avenger.

 

@Mokona=Modoki
But they get that also if they take the paladin lvl late. Before getting lvl 9 spells I would advise against it sisce the quest bonus is worth less than earlier powerfull spells, but in the end the one that takes a pal lvl early will become a little bit stronger than the same char that takes the pal lvl late.

 

I'm not so sure that the ability to use the HA for a sorc should mean that much. Do you really want your sorc in melee. The one upside of a sorc being able to wield the HA is all that nice additional spell resistance.

I suppose if you're playing a smaller party and the chances of your sorc ending up in melee increase, then taking a level or 2 of pally, and some increased melee ability (plus the ability to wield the HA) isn't all that bad a thing.

 

Since Klorox will level squat he'll still gain his sorcerer levels sooner than normal, paladin levels or not.
A paladin2/sorcerer28 is superior to a sorcerer30 and I guess for a powergamer it will hurt if he doesn't take free +1 str and wis. Since you can do the holy avenger quest very late in the game (and can take therefore the paladin levels very late) the delay in gaining high level spells will only be short.

 

Thanks a lot so far. I'm glad I haven't heard any "this party sucks" responses.

Without spoiling me too much, what chapter does a Paladin get this bonus? Also, when will a Cleric of Bane get her bonus? Do you keep stuff when importing from normal mode to HoF?

 

the paladin bonus comes in chapter 5.
You get to keep most stuff, but not quest specific stuff and I think you'll loose some other things too.
Maybe someone else here remembers exactly what kind of items you loose better?

 

I've decided to go with a Bard/Druid for character #6. A Female Drow, with one level of Dreadmaster of Bane.

The levels will probably look like this:

Bard 11/Druid 18/Dreadmaster 1

I will build the character up to Bard 11/Dreadmaster 1 before ever adding Druid levels. I will squat until I can get Druid 10, and then take the XP penalties as they come. This character is in my party only as a supporting member, and will be singing and casting buffs 99% of the time.

She'll act as a pretty good "mule" for a long time, as she should be behind the rest of the party in levels.

If you do not lost the Holy Avenger sword, I'll definitely add a level or two of Paladin to my Sorcerer character. Not that I ever expect that character to enter combat, but the Magic Resistance helps!

 

You can keep the items when exporting to HoF mode.
It's optional when you do the holy avenger quest which yields the paldin bonusses. It can be done in the middle of chapter5 until the point of no return shortly before the game's final battle in chapter6.

 

And what about the Dreadmaster of Bane bonus?

 

Dreadmaster of Bane wis bonus can be obtained as early as the start of chapter 5. I don't know if there is a limit to how late it can be obtained besides, obviously, right before the final battle sequence. The Holy Avenger bonus can be obtained as early as late chapter 5 and as late as right before the final battle sequence.

Speaking of permanent bonuses, unless you have some special fondness for illusionists, or if your character is a gnome who will multiclass in such a way that illusionist would decrease exp penalty, it's better to use a transmuter. This is because transmuters with 10+ alchemy rank can give themselves +5 max hp in chapter 4, whereas illusionists have no special quest. Both are specialist wizards with the same opposition schools, so transmuters are simply better than illusionists except for gnomes. Of course, the hp bonus isn't that big, so if you like illusionists, feel free to use them.

Paladin 2 isn't all that useful. You get a bit better BAB, fearlessness, and Aura of Courage. However, several spells, such as Remove Fear, Impervious Sanctity of Mind, and Exaltation, grant fearlessness to anybody, not just the paladin. There is also Mind Blank, which lasts an entire day. Simply buff everyone with Mind Blank (and Cat's Grace and Eagle's Splendor), then rest, and you will have full charges of those levels of spells and still have the buffs active.

As it happens, I use sorcerers in melee quite often. In fact, I use the L7 spell charges on Mordekain's Sword more often than on DBFB, despite DBFB being the most damaging direct damage spell in the game. Speaking of Mordekain's Sword, this is a pretty obvious reason the Holy Avenger would not be used for melee, even if the sorcerer is sent to do damage: Mordekain's Sword works better. +15 Spell Resistance, on the other hand, stacks quite nicely with the +25 SR bonus from Holy Aura and makes the character immune to spells cast by casters 20 and below and has a 50% chance of resisting your own spells even after your characters hit L30 (except for the few spells that can't be resisted, of course). It works perfectly on a character that needs protection.

As for exporting: You keep any item except bags and the items contained therein, except for a few quest items, such as Tamjan's Bracers; Peridot of Healing; various letters, keys, and such. The Holy Avenger, despite being obtained through a quest, is saved. It should be noted that the game automatically exports your characters when you complete the game, but it exports the data just before the final battle, so if you want to keep the items and exp you get during the last battle, then you need to do a manual export.

[Edit] Forgot about this bug
http://www.sorcerers.net/ubb/ultimatebb.php?/topic/14/2911.html
Could be in favor of illusionists in the illusionist vs. transmuter comparison.

[ January 14, 2007, 23:51: Message edited by: Mokona=Modoki ]

 

More on exporting...

Manual exports are much better. Not only are nearly all "quest items" removed, but so are containers, such as gem bags, potion bags, and, most importantly, bags of holding. If there's any item you've stored away in a container, you need to put it in your normal inventory prior to doing a manual export.


Regarding Mord's Sword ... It's certainly a great spell for a mage to use. But remember that while it seems like a ranged weapon, it is really a melee weapon with a really long range. And if you strike a character that has something like a fire shield up with Mord's Sword at considerable range, your mage will still take damage from the fire shield, in spite of being well outside of what seems to be normal melee range. (This one bit me on the butt the first time I used Mord's Sword in IWD2.)

 

http://www.sorcerers.net/Games/IWD2/index_tips.php

Just get it over with and read the powergamer guides Klorox you know that you will never be happy with a party until its the epitome of power and perfection anyways so why not ?

So just save yourself from continually restarting another 50 times and just get it over with at least this way you KNOW there really wont be any other way to improve them so you can actually just PLAY the game!

Hehe, for a change

 

LMAO! You know me so well raptor!

I'm well on my way, and I REFUSE to turn back now!

More updates to follow...

Curious: The "Paladin Bonus"... does it apply to all Paladins in the party, or only one?

TIA

[ January 26, 2007, 03:22: Message edited by: Klorox ]

 

to all.