Shadows of Undrentide - Overall thoughts

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Well, I have almost finished Shadows of Unrentide for the first time. I think so anyway, my Bard / Fighter / RDD is at level 11 and everyone says you get to Level 12 by the end so I must be almost done. So I figured it was time to share my thoughts on the game so far:
- even though it uses the same boring tileset as the OC, it seems to be more varied and lively
- it is a very nice length, some would say too short, but at the speed I play, it is plenty long enough for me
- the henchmen are marginally more useful than the OC ones but not much more. Xanos, in particular seems like a complete waste of space.
- there is a nice spread of useful magical items without too many overpowering ones
- there are some nice innovative plot elements. I particularly liked the quest for the Wise Wind in the Undrentide Library.
- I thought that recruitable giant ant was pretty cool
- the 'dungeon' portions are not too long
- there were some really tough fights that had me stumped for ages, but not too many to be discouraging.

Overall, I have quite enjoyed it, although my final opinion will be determined by how good the ending is (so no spoilers yet please). It is definitely less tedious than the original campaign.

 

Having completed SoU for the first time quite recently (ironically, with a Fighter/Sorc/RDD), I can echo these sentiments.

I was very happy about:
- the challenge level, since getting hammered by kobolds is quite humbling;
- the backstory was solid and enjoyable, and most of the characters (even the ones you're there to butcher) have a tale or two;
- the prestige classes;
- the desert tomb interlude;
- no ham-fisted romances (hey, I'm a fan of them in BG2, but if it's going to be done, it needs to be done well).

However, I was disappointed with:
- the limited henchmen choices;
- "periodically invincible" opponents;
- the lack of magic items, particularly magic weapons of greater than +1 enchantment;
- the lower finishing level, compared to the OC (12 vs 16), which has implications for importing into HotU. This can be remedied by a quick re-play of some parts of the OC or even SoU, so it's nothing too problematic.

Other than that, I enjoyed it. I will be replaying it soon with a Half-Orc Barbarian/Blackguard.

 

The lack of magic items is a GOOD thing! Means that your character creation options take on more significance as it is harder to cover up a deficiency with a super powered item.

Prestige classes rule, as do feats and skills. They add a whole dimension that is not there with 2e games like BGII.

 

There was a recruitable giant ant?!

I must have missed that.

There's also nice secrets like (read on if you like secrets revealed...)

Taking the baby from a house raided by kobolds and keeping it, then turning it into a drider in HotU.

I agree entirely with HB about the magic items bit.

 

Giant ant? Well, sort of. If you make peace with the formian queen, she'll send one of her myrmarchs to help you temporarily. Not really an ant, but very ant-like, in a centaur-is-a-horse kind of way.

 

Don't get me wrong, I think that anti-munchkinism is a good thing (if it's even a word). It makes finding something which is supposedly rare and magical a great moment in the game.

Games shouldn't function like Christmas, but there's a difference between being proportionate and miserly. Coming up against enemies you couldn't put a dent in because you only had a mundane/+1 weapon got annoying after a while. My F/S/RDD didn't get a magic weapon he could use effectively until the Manticore battle in the Interlude.

 

Yeah, just before the end of the Interlude you can get this super powerful giant ant to help you out and he stays until the end of the Interlude.

What does it matter if you don't have a magic weapon until the interlude? You don't fight anything powerful enough to need one until then anyway. What about that Cold short sword from the icy kobold guy?

 

Well... 'cos... umm... to be frank, I didn't get that short sword until a point where I had almost finished Chapter One (did J'Nah first) and it ended up in Dorna's hands so she could actually dent stuff with sneak attacks.

Out of curiosity, HB, exactly what point are you at in SoU? Recovered all three Winds? Ascended into the Temple? I don't want to spoil anything for you.

 

Well, I hate re-loading.
So I try to play these kind of games with great precaution and planning.
But in SoU, there were some places where the games cannot be carried on without re-loading.
One was while fighting Medusa handmaidens. (I might have missed something that protects you against petrification.) Essentially, with 5% chance of being stoned by rolling 1, and 16 medusas to kill, I am going to be stoned definitely.
Same holds true while fighting basilisks.
Greater Wind Zombie is another painful thing. My Cleric never keeps 'Clarity' ready and that zombie damages too much with each shot. I think the game is disbalanced in that particular fight.
So, I would still prefer OC.
But agreed, the story was better, landscape was more varied, shorter dungeons etc. Re-writing story was a very innovative plot.

 

Shivi: some of that stuff you posted might be spoilers. Otherwise, I agree with you that some fights are just way to difficult compared with the average level. I think the best example is Rumbottom, though. I could hardly kill this guy when I first get to him (granted, the game offers you a variety of ways of soliving the quest which do not require killing, but still).

Also, some way tough encounters are the manticore and the blackguard in the tomb. About this last one, I remember running merrily around dispatcing zombies, then I saw this guy. I was thinking, how tough can it be, charge him right on; needless to say, I found out the hard way. At least with the manticore, you have some advance warning.

Otherwise, I found SoU quite enjoyable. I had no big gripes with the OC, either. But with cooler personalities and inventory management for henchmen, new feats, a bit more interesting story, SoU is better.

 

I wouldn't say unbalanced there. It's a good, tough fight that I found to be interesting - getting the Dead (right wind, right?) Wind was definitely a great battle because you couldn't just go in slashing and smashing until everyone's dead.

 

I've only got the Wise Wind so far, but I am close to getting the one in the Crypt. Don't worry too much about spoilers because if you start talking about a monster I don't recognise, I can't tell if it's one coming up or one that I missed (or forgot) from earlier.

 

I don't remember much about the Winds quests, but I definitely remember the Greater Zombie... I succeeded in killing the Wind after some experimenting, and then I was left this guy to deal with. Xanos bought the farm early (as usual) and I was by myself. Couldn't quite get a hit on him, so I cast a blade barrier and started running around it as a maniac . He just keep going through it... (since zombies apparently are not too bright ) did not succed in killing him before the spell's expiration, but brought his hit points way down.

 

I liked the little touches, like the kobolds in the kitchen early on. There were various ways to solve that situation depending on your class. Bards could mesmerize them with a song; druids and mages could cast Sleep; you could negotiate a peaceful resolution or simply slaughter them.

Many animals could be spoken to if you were a Ranger or Druid and that stolen baby quest had several options to resolve.

Minor things I suppose, but to me they added flavor to SoU. I get a little irked when people diss SoU because it didn't have any +10 Uber Swords of Doom and rooms full of Soul-Eating Shadow Demons.

 

All good points, Sir Fink.

I just encountered that greater zombie. What a nightmare. He always managed to nail me in about two hits. The only thing that saved me was the regeneration qualities of the Greater Amulet of Health so I could run around in circles and heal enough to jump back in to do 2 points of damage to him. I used a couple of acid flasks on him too which actually did more damage than any weapon I had.

But the rudest thing was that after all that (it took about half an hour), it was only worth 115 XP! Such a piddly amount for the toughest enemy I had faced so far in this game.

 

Yeah, that Wind Zombie is certainly a tough nut to crack. I couldn't dent him with fire or a power-attacking RDD, and his stun ability made that battle a case of "flee or die" for me. Thankfully, he drops whenever the Dead Wind re-activates its zombie-spawning power.

Sir Fink - Agreed, especially with that last point; if that's what people want, they should play IWD2 or HOTU. I just wanted a weapon that could actually hurt the enemies in Undrentide (that weren't spiders); a +2, or +1 with an extra 1d6 elemental damage that wasn't Desert Fury would have been fine. I was lugging around a +1 weapon until I ascended into the Temple of the Winds.

 

NonSequitur: there are some clubs +2 for sale in the interlude I remember last time I played, I spent over 20k of my hard earned gold on one of those. Did not get much use of it though, just kept it in reserve for those enemies with damage resistance.

 

Cool - I just finished Shadows of Undrentide last night. My character ended up on Bard 4 / Fighter 4 / RDD 5 which seems OK.

One odd thing was the amount of great treasure that showed up right at the end. I got a cool armour of speed but what is the point when the game is almost over?

Overall, I enjoyed this game. It some quiet innovative parts to it and it didn't drag on and on pointlessly (like Throne of Bhaal does).

Now, on to Hordes of the Underdark!

 

Finished SOU last night. My Fighter 6/Rogue 1/Blackguard 5 levelled up just as he whomped the final boss, so he'll get another rogue level at the start of HOTU for evasion and extra skill points in conversation/taunting abilities.

One thing I noticed is that certain bits of the game seemed tailored to showcase the new prestige classes included with the expansion. I could see certain parts of the game being annoyingly hard had I not been a strength-based Blackguard: The medusa handmaidens would have been horrible without my Nymph's Cloak +5 and potions of Eagle's Splendour to pump my saves sky high, and I would probably have lost the war of attrition as I fully explored the Plane of Shadow with any other character. This, of course, means that there were lots of nice options for playing evil, and I had tremendous fun murdering the arcane archer in the woods, betraying the nomads in the desert and suchlike.

I found the magic weapon situation to be fine, as my character specialised in Battleaxes and Heavy Flails. I used the regenerating +2 Battleaxe from the great library with a mirror shield +3 for most situations and Jergal's Flail when I needed a bit more punch. That was +3 enchantment +1d6 cold damage to good, although I think it may have been only usable by evil characters. Also, I actually didnt mind that the really best stuff like the dragon armour and chainmail of speed didnt come until right near the end. I found in other games where you could get that stuff early it made things a bit easy, and it was nice to have a substantial boost just before the final battle.

Another pleasant thing I found was that (within reason) if there was a situation for which your character was ill suited, there was usually a magic item available to help out while still leaving the encounter a challenge. The infamous Greater WInd Zombie springs to mind, as the fight would have been much tougher without the dragons blood power stone to knock down the small fry and keep me all stoneskinned up. It allowed me to concentrate on the bad boy himself and nullified all but his criticals, which still stung like a beast. 75 damage. Ouch...

Overall, I thought SOU was a splendid module with enough variation and enough economy of length to keep it replayable. Certainly an improvement on the OC, in which I still havent even got halfway.

[ November 08, 2005, 15:39: Message edited by: Will ]

 

Will - amazing. I managed to finish the game without encountering half of the magic items that you seemed to have found. Either I missed them completely, or there is a changeable aspect to the appearance of some items.

Agree about the comparison to the OC though. I could easily play SoU again but I doubt I would ever venture into that crappy OC again.