POLL: Another "Updating My Computer" -Topic

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So it's decided: during the next month I will be upgrading my computer with new parts and to save money, keeping some of my old ones. Still, it's basically a whole new machine. Skip the following if you aren't interested of technical specs.

CPU: Athlon 64 3500+
MoBo: MSI Neo2 FIR (8xUSB2, RAID, Audio, LAN, AGP8x, Firewire)
RAM: 2x 512 DDR (400 MHz)
GPU: Ti-4400 (128 Mb, old one)
HDD: Seagate 160 Gb (7200 RPM, 8 meg cache)
Case: Nice, black case (350 W, costs 65 €)

I have few questions, though. First, do I need Firewire and what does it do? Second, does that RAM work in async or should I just go for a single 1 Gt comb? Lastly, should I change the powersource of that case since it sounds a bit cheap?

Yes, I know; the GPU card is a bit old by now (as per THIS chart), but I have to save money somewhere and I can later upgrade to 6800 GT series (how is ATI, by the way?) when their prices have dropped to something like 150€. The main point here was to walk the golden middle-road to get good machine with reasonable price.

Total: 550 € installed and delivered, when giving the old parts in exchange. So, thumbs up or thumbs down?

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Poll Results: Another "Updating my Computer" -Topic (4 votes.)

Another "Updating my Computer" -Topic (Choose 1)
* Thumbs up - 75% (3)
* Thumbs down - 25% (1)

 

To make it simple, Firewire is a bit like USB. Although, not so widely used. So you need it only if you have (or are going to have) devices that use it.

About the PSU, it depends on the brand and model. A quality 250W PSU can be better than a ping-pong 400W. Check the ampere values.

 

Yes, I would upgrade the power supply. Try www.tomshardware.com. He used to have an explanation/comparison of good power supplies. But I have not been back there for a long time. I only go when I am thinking about upgrading. I would also go with a bigger HD. They are very cheap now and a 250 or 300 Gig will be very little additional cost. What about a new CD reader. Very fast CD R/W and DVD R/W can be had for under $70.

 

Plextor 8x DVD-burner from my old comp, bought only about 6 months ago, and the HDD was really 200 gigs (remembered it wrong). Considering that my current one is only about 30, the new one should last for the next 10 years, at least.

 

Sorry no javascript so I cannot vote. You will need a new PSU as soon as you get that 6800GT even at 350W you may have stability problems.
I think that board was quite a good'un but - but I'd consider going for a socket 939 with SLI and mulitcore capability if you can afford it.
The 3500 A64 is a good price and performance CPU.

 

I was thinking the same, but the AGP-card was the bottleneck: 450€ of one was simply too much for me, but guess I could live with THIS card until I can get 6800 GT for cheap. So the new setup would be:

A64 3500+
K8N Neo4 Platinum 54G <-- "54G?" WTF?
GF6 6600, 256 RAM
2x 512 DDR400 RAM
Seagate 200 Gb HDD
Plextor PX-712A 8x DVD-burner
Audigy 2 ZS
Hitachi 17" LCD

Plus some black case with a ~400 W powersource. It will be costing about 650€ in total when I give my old PC in trade, so it's just and just acceptable, 700 being my absolute limit. Dual-core is nice and all, but they are way too expensive and it will take about 2 years before their prices are acceptable, so I'd better just update my BIOS for support and upgrade later if need.

All that new and shiny tech is nice and appealing, but simply too expensive.

[ May 31, 2005, 21:24: Message edited by: Wirhe ]

 

Yes I fogot about the Ti4400 - you'll need a new card to go to PCI express.
If you get an SLI board you could go 6600GT - then put another one in 2*6600gt cost about the same as a 6800gt but you will get performance of 6800ultra or better for most games. And probably better residual value as 2 cards will sell better than one when the next generation appear. You might just want to get the one stick of ram and get a board with sound. When you've got the cash get your 2nd dimm and audiolgy.

All this kit just to play disciples 2

I've been reading up a little on dual core - for gaming its a bit of a waste of time at the moment apparently AMD reckon there single core processors will be superior for games for the forseable future.

[ May 31, 2005, 15:23: Message edited by: Tap Dancing Oyster ]

 

The Neo2-FIR is a socket 939 mainboard, so it should support AMD dual core processors with a BIOS upgrade. Regarding the 64 3500 processor: AMD now has a new core - Venice. I think it's a small matter, but it is a slight uprgrade from the Winchester core - less heat and refined memory controller. But both cores are still 90nm.

The addition of firewire is nice if you have a digital camcorder (or plan on one).

http://www.msicomputer.com/product/p_spec.asp?model=K8T_Neo2-FIR&class=mb

Nice mainboard.

 

Neo2 was what I had intended, but that "new" AGP-card is PCI-E, so it has to be Neo4. That SLI option sounds like a good plan since K8N Platinum SLI costs only a little more. But doesn't the card need to support it too...? If so, I doubt the mainstream models support it.

 

http://www.msicomputer.com/product/p_spec.asp?model=K8N_Neo4_Platinum/SLI&class=mb

Well, the Neo4 Platinum SLI is a high-end mainboard. And so is the price: around $175.00 US. But if you plan on keeping it a while, that is a better option. It is also an nForce4 chipset, instead of the VIA KT800.

 

Checked it out, SLI I mean, and perhaps it is a bit too "shiny" again.

I don't need that advanced HD feature when I have my Audigy 2, and I think that upgrading to 6800 GT later is enough for my wallet. This alone should offer a solid performance without me needing to pay 1000+ from my student's budget.

 

Yes, since it's a high-end mainboard, you will probably want high-end memory also. And since it is new technology, it will support SATA II, which also supports NCQ. So you will want your new hard disk to be second generation SATA II also...more $$$.

 

The way I'd look at this is that if you go AGP now you'll be buying a new mobo sooner rather than later.
The motherboard is probably the main thing to get right at this point. Any of the PCI Express Nvidia range can be used in a SLI set up. Why not leave the TFT monitor until later and use your current one. This will give you an extra 300 euros to play with.
You can go as far as an ATI800/850XT but I wouldn't put any money on the next generation of cards being released on AGP. Nvidia and ATI took enough time to release their full current generations on this platform.
If you look at this from a historic perspective 400-500 euro cards are generally beaten by the next generations 200 euro cards. If you are going to gaming regularily I would strongly advise PCI express. In fact I'd consider this change as important as when cards moved to AGP from standard PCI several years ago.

 

Sorry, perhaps I should had been clearer: that monitor IS my current one, as is the burner and soundcard. If you checked the previous link, you'll notice that the graphics card is PCI-E too -thus the change in motherboard (to Neo4).

Nah, I wan't to play UT2k4, Quake 4, Half Life 2, The Sims 2, and Guild Wars at max graphics without any stuttering.

 

Your going to have cut back a bit then somewhere - do some research on prices. If your primarily gaming then GPU and CPU are the highest priority. As a consequence your mobo needs to be up to scratch. If you check Toms (I'm always using this site i know) he has an article on SLI athlon 64 boards at the moment (May 29th) take a look at the performance on his site.
The site also has a preview of the next gen nvidia cards 7800GTX. I'm sure its been only about a year since the 6 series was launched. The 7 series is expected to launched in the next few days.
Memory is not so much of an issue for AMD as it is for Intel, something to do with the memory controller being installed as part of the Athlon CPU. The biggest gains seem to be using quick CAS timings rather than high frequencies. Don't ask me for explaination on this, all I know is that the higher quality memory you have the faster timings you can set in your bios.

 

That should be interesting, because there are millions of mainboards out there that are running AGP graphics. So, do the manufactures leave that segment of the market to chance? Or do they try to force PCI Express on all those millions of users? A lot of those users are quite content with their AGP boards, as PCI-E has been very slow at catching on, and the performance gains are small at this point.

I'm not sure what they will do at this point, but I think it could go either way. It should be interesting to see how they choose to market these new cards.

Think of it this way: if you are nVidia, do you leave the AGP market if ATI is willing to release cards that support both platforms? That's potentially leaving a lot of bucks on the table for your competitor to pick up.

 

It's a real shame that there isn't mainboards that would support both AGP8x and PCI-E during this transfer-time. In my case, I would had liked to keep my GF4 for a while, but since it's one or the other... (And I can get that used 6600 relatively cheaply now...)

 

I know Elitegroup do one for the Pentium but you take a big performance hit - I was thinking of getting one myself. Do a search I think you'll find one somewhere - not sure how good they are. You won't find an SLI/agp though.