Insurance Pains

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Is anybody else upset with their insurance? I know I am, and for very good reason. I have no choice with who I get insurance from. I have to go through ICBC. And they rip me off completely.

Every chance they get, they screw me out of money. Because they make the rules, and there is nobody else to compete with. I believe that a little competition would be a good thing in this case.

Maybe I'm over reacting, and maybe I don't "know the score" as old people are fond of saying. But I do know that giving a company a monopoly over an industry is a bad thing.

So, what is your opinion?

 

Why on earth do you have no choice as to who you get insurance from? Surely Canada has more than one insurance company!

 

There are many insurance companies to choose from, Jaguar. Many insurance companies are international.

What do you mean they try to screw you out of money?

 

It would help a lot if you explained what type of insurance you were talking about?

Personally I have car, travel, home and life insurance policies, all with different companies.

The ones you'll tend to get stung for on a personal level is car insurance if you're under 25 here in the UK.

Commercial insurances are a different matter, in todays litigious age Profesional indemnity, public liability and terrorism insurances are the worst for stiching you up.

Regardless of all that, all of these should surely be available from many companies. How come you cannot shop around?

 

I'm happy with all of my insurance providers except my last healthcare provider. Get this:

They have a website that lists participating doctors. I pick one, go, pay my co-pay... and then get a bill because the doc is non-participating? This has happened MULTIPLE TIMES. What information am I supposed to rely on, if not that provided by the insurer themselves?

When Marcus was born, I took care of all the pre-registration paperwork so that on Delivery Day we wouldn't have to do it. My care was just fine, but we got a bill for the in-house service to examine the baby because he wasn't pre-registered. What kind of stupid is that?

The problem is, healthcare companies are required to show a profit every quarter to keep the shareholders and Board happy. They have to get more and more creative in how they squeeze those pennies out, and it's always the patients and doctors who take the hit. Providing good quality care is NOT their priority - never has been, never will be. Don't ever forget that.

 

It's quite typical that one gets screwed over by the insurance companies in Finland. Especially with permanent handicaps the insurance companies tend to do everything to avoid paying. They usually have their own doctors to examine the patient and there doctors are corrupt and definently untrustworthy and what's worse their judgement can be overridden only by the courts and these trials take years. Of course in a way this is understandable since insurance fraud is also very common but it's still a disgrace when these things happen, and usually their effects can be very fatal for a family.

 

ICBC is the Insurance Corporation of British Columbia, and is the only company that anyone living in B.C. and insuring anything (home, car, private possesions, ect.) can go through.

There are arguments that claim that it was worse when it was private, and that there are many reasons to keep it public, such as:

and;

I see that a bullsh*t and moneymaking narguments. The reason I am upset is that there is nothing I can do to stop them from taking advantage of me. If I have a problem with them with my auto insurance, it is a matter of "Fine then, don't drive."

This article backs up my argument.

I myself am being screwed around by ICBC. When I got a few speeding tickets (yes, I deserved them and yes, I paid for them) not only did I have to pay the tickets themselves, but I have to pay for the 'points' that I incurred because of them.

My friend is in debt 10,000 with ICBC because an older lady who happens to work at ICBC (and is therefore more responsible and trustworthy) ran into the back of his car. My friend is of course fighting this, but it is taking foreve3r and is effecting his finances.

There, my rant is backed up with links. Now does anybody have any ideas on how to get out from the heel of this totalitarian regime? Or am I doomed to wage war with those paid and entrusted to 'insure' me?

 

I am stunned that you have NO competition for insurance! Is that a bit like the setup you have in Canada where there is only one company you can buy beer from ("The Beer Shop")?

I find this situation very odd and almost communist in its justification. It seems to be contrary to what you would expect from a free-market economy.

I see you have two options:
1) Move to a more free country or state
2) Take advantage of the fact that this is state-run and follow the appropriate channels (e.g. letters to newspapers, the insurance ombudsman etc)

Oh, and by the way, drive more safely.

 

Most Canadian provinces don't have government run insurance but every once and a while you get someone who thinks that the insurance companies are too greedy and tries to argue that the government would do a better job for the people.

It is the same argument as the one over health care really - all Canadian provinces have government run health care systems and there are constant arguments about whether the private sector could do a better job of it. However, the majority seem to think private insurance and public health care is the way to go.

We most certainly do have privately run insurance in Ontario - I recently changed insurance companies myself and managed to save a couple hundred dollars/year.

As far as the government control of alcohol - again that is only in some Canadian provinces. In Quebec you can buy alcohol in just about any grocery or variety store.

We have historically had a very vocal puritanical minority here in Ontario that would be quite happy to ban the "evil demon" alcohol. To keep these nut cases happy the govenment has acted to restrict as much as possible the sale of alcohol - it is also a huge money maker for the government but that could just as easily be accomplished by a sin tax on private sector alcohol sales. Fortunately the anti-alcohol lobby appears to be slowly losing its clout.

 

Gods... remind me to never go to Canada to work then (heh, aspiring insurance agent here). There would be no point in my profession if I worked in BC.

But NO alternatives? Is this because the government does not allow competition or is the manopoly so strong that they would just undercut any competition? Sounds mighty horrible to me, especially with the corruption I'm hearing about with that old lady (in NZ if you drive into the back of someone YOU are in the wrong no matter what).

 

I believe that the law in B.C. says that you must have at least the base minimum amount of coverage and it has to be from the ICBC - i.e. by law you must buy the provincal government's insurance so the government has used the law to ensure monopoly power. I don't think that there is anything stopping you from buying insurance from another party on top of the government insurance but that would be mostly redundent.

Abomination - if you ever did want to come to Canada I am sure that you could find plenty of work as long as you looked in other provinces. Back in my public accounting days I did the accounting and tax for several insurance agents and they made a pretty decent living.

 

Just out of interest, what do people pay for car insurance? I've been quoted around £550 for fully comprehensive on a 1.25 ford fiesta (I don't own one but I'll have to drive to one of the potential new jobs and it was the first small car that came to mind when trying to find insurance costs.). I'm 29 but without any no-claims bonus.

 

I (a 20 year old male with a '92 Ford Escort, no recorded accidents, and base coverage) get charged $120 CAD a month ($97 USD or £51). That is $1440 CAD a year ($1165 USD or £617).

And my coverage does not mean squat. If something happens to my car, I am better off fixing it myself in most cases rather then paying ICBC. For example, when someone broke my side window with a rock, it cost me $120 to fix, whereas if I were to have gone through ICBC, I would have had to pay a $300 deductable and watch my premiums go up.

 

Now, I agree that there's no point in turning in a $120 claim if you have a $300 deductible. However, there's no way that your insurance should go up in such a case. The only way your insurance should go up is if you were "at fault".

I'll explain by example. My wife and I have each been involved in an accident in the last two years. In my wife's case, she was at fault, in my case, the other driver was at fault. My wife backed into a pole and did $507 worth of damamge to her car. We have a $500 deductible, and it would have been silly to turn that into our insurance company, because we would only have been reimbursed $7 on the $507 bill, and our insurance could have gone up. In my case, a guy hit me from behind and did $1705 damage to my car. Since I am not "at fault" for the damage, I pay no deductible, and the other guy's insurance company mailed me a check for $1705 to pay for the repairs. My insurance didn't go up, but it is quite possible that the other guy's insurance did.

 

Of course, man! This is self-explanatory, you needn't write it down.

Sorry for going off-topic...

 

Rally,

That's exactly why I think that healthcare should be a non-profit thing.

 

Ragusa,

Just curious, but are you stating that the healthcare insurance industry should be non-profit, or all of healthcare, e.g. doctors, pharm, hospitals, etc?

I might be able to go along with the insurance thing, though these are multi-national conglomerates, and I am not sure how we could force them into it, but I have a concern as to the level of R&D that would be placed into new advances without profitability to drive it.

 

I guess it's time to pull out the conservative Morgoroth in this issue.

I support privatized health care because the government healthcare is so damn ineffective. Millions of euros are lost in useless beurocracy and the hospitals are filled with doctors lacking the motivation for they job because all the best really do everything they can to get a job in the private sector because they pay more. Additionally we really can't afford it in its current form so serious reforms are needed sooner or later. I have had a few quite horrible incidents with public healthcare and today I do everything I can to avoid hospital visits, which is not a very good thing. I however would not want the american system since without insurance you're quite screwed there. What I would like to see is a move to a closley superviced private system in which the government then pays to the private companies for those who can't afford their healthcare. Thirdly getting into an operation can be a real pain, some elderly people have to wait for two years to get their legs operated, with eyeproblems those lines can be up to five years long. Needless to say this is way too much and a clear sign that something does not work.

After loosing my nerves several times with the public health care I moved to using the private healthcare which is very expensive but the government pays a part of the bill. If they would pay a bit more I'm sure private healthcare could be made affordable for all.

 

@ Aldeth

For those premiums, I am not entirely sure. All I know is that my friend once claimed a similar case (where he was not at fault) and the person working on his case told him his premium went up because he 'didn't do everything in his power to prevent it.'

 

@ Jag

Without knowing the details of your friend's situation, I can't say for sure. But unless he stood by and watched someone throw a rock through his window, I don't see how he could have prevented it.

Generally speaking if someone hits your car while your car isn't moving (or in your case when you weren't even IN the car), there's no way the insurance company won't pay for it. Exceptions to this rule would be, for example, if you illegally parked. You can't illegally double park on a street, and then complain is someone hits your car.

Of course, in your case, this is entirely moot, as you wouldn't get any money back if you had $120 worth of damage and have a $300 deductible.