Persecuted Germans find political asylum in the US

Remove all ads!

A good teacher knows how to present things in multiple ways, through multiple lenses. I have been told I'm a good teacher. I don't know if it's true or not, but my wife certainly is.

This is 100% correct, and an excellent assessment of the situation. Unfortunately, as long as we have mandated public schooling, it's likely to continue. For that reason, simply to keep my child out of a wasteful situation like that, homeschooling is an option. Private schools are also an option, as they can have more disciplinary authority, including kicking a child out for just bad behavior, but again, they're pricey.

 

Alternative public schools are another option. Just as a good school system is obligated to create special programs and accommodations for both particularly gifted kids and kids with mental defects, it should also develop alternative schools and curricula for kids with behavior problems. Send them all over to the alternative middle/high school if they won't behave.

 

In a public system you just can't give up on kids. When a teenager starts doing drugs and is getting into trouble with the police because he's dealing it's really hard to sit back and watch as this kid is ruining his life so you try anyway. Still, it's very sad when you realize that there is absolutely nothing you can do to help one of your students.

@NOG: private schools probably only make it worse. In a private system I doubt you're going to expel a kid if the school needs the money and the kid's family is really wealthy and well connected. On another note, private schools can afford to select pupils so they can just get rid of the ones with problems instead of helping them (and those kids end up in public schools when it's probably too late to do anything for them). People keep going on about how private schools are better. It's not necessarily true. If you select kids it makes getting results way easier besides private schools don't have to cope with all the bull from the government either (over here teachers are told how they should teach by people who no longer teach or have never even taught).

Homeschooling can be a solution for people who can afford it but IMO it's bad as far as social skills go. In school children also learn to cope with others and that is a valuable thing in and by itself. So if you want your kid to be homeschooled you should definitely try and get your kid to be involved in activities that will allow some room for socializing.

It already exists but it can't be used for all kids with problems (which would mean that the system is giving up on them and would only push them over the edge) and it shouldn't be a permanent solution. The objective for any kid who is in such a situation is to try and work on those personal issues so that he or she can be reintegrated in a normal classroom.

The real solution would be to support teachers more by giving them more psychological training besides their academic and teaching training so they'd know how to deal with kids with problems. Of course increasing the number of educators whose role is to deal with situations as they come up would not be a luxury. Last but not least, classes with no more than 15 students or pupils would be a big step in the right direction (especially in more difficult environments where drugs and violence are real problems).

Of course all this would cost a lot of money (and I mean a lot). Money most governments would rather spend on something else entirely.

 

I was not referring to subject matter. That is where you are going wrong, NOG. You will find out the importance this is when you have children of your own in school.

 

Oh, absolutely, but as I said in an earier post, that's pretty standard around here these days. In some areas, there are even organizations of homeschoolers that share lesson plans, teaching materials, plan group field-trips, even merge 'classes' if one parent can't teach for a day (or week or whatever). These also generally involve some sort of extra-curricular activity that may or may not be limited to that organization (i.e. they may have a baseball team, or just all put their kids in one local team).

Psych training, more teachers, better facilities, and more disciplinary authority would all help. Unfortunately, the first three cost and the last one would have parents in an uproar (and various child advocacy groups).

If you're talking about ways to deal with people, that's what the social activities are for. I don't think education should be blended with that, at least not as far as teachers go, unless necessary. It tends to put the education at risk.

 

No, I'm speaking of the desire, or passion, for learning. I don't care what the subject is: I'm not going to badger my 8 and 6 year-old about the different approachs to, say, Chaucer's _Canterbury Tales_, whether a formalist approach, or new theory, or feminist, or historical. Really, who's going to teach any of this stuff at a elementary level anyway?

In 1st grade my oldest daughter had a wonderful teacher, whom she just adored. They were "two peas in a pod," so to speak. Her teacher would bring in her pet tarantula, or her gecko, which thrilled my daughter to no end. She spent hours learing about "critters" - she was fired up. For a 7 year old, she learned all she could.

This year she didn't like her teacher and she didn't like school very much, which surprised the hell out of me. Her teacher was "all business" - cut and dry. Her grades were fine but she was uninspired. I could tell she was going through the motions, but like I said, she was still bringing home very good grades.

But then one day, her teacher brought in some musical instruments he had crafted himself out just "stuff," junk basically. But they were interesting and sounded pretty good, from what she tells me ( I guess it's a hobby for him). That fired her up again. Believe me, this house is full of ready made instruments that she could pick up and start learning anytime: An upright piano in the game room, a full set of drums in my office along with 4 guitars and an amp; a violin and a flute in one of the closets, which no one plays (I can't remember how I picked up the violin). She never had any interest in playing any of them. But all of a sudden she wanted to make her own musical instrument out of whatever we had in the garage. Sure enough, we found some stuff and made one. In the process, I was finally able to tell her about some basic scales and intervals, and the acoustical properties of different materials we were using. And then I was even able to explain the different properties of the woods that made up some of the intruments we had around the house.

This is what I mean about how different teachers are able to get them to see through their own lenses in the learning process - their own personal learning experiences, each one being somewhat unique. As long as my kids have a desire, or passion to really learn, I don't care what is they want to learn about.

 

@Chandos: finding a way to relate to a teacher is important especially for younger students. What you describe doesn't surprise me in the least. A teacher who is "all business" will not create the same interest. When the kids realize that you are passionate about something they tend to get interested. I had a similar experience when I started talking about movies, actually using movie lines and showing scenes as examples to explain grammatical points or posters and stills to get them to talk. Go figure. In the end it's the result that counts.

 

A friend of mine is a (young, idealistic, capable, sarcastic) teacher and he teaches maths, history and also music. He does System Of A Down, Metallica or Nirvana songs with the kids, and tasks them with learning and performing these songs to the other kids in class (The idea being: If he has to do this, he wanted to at least enjoy the music). Everybody has to perform and to collaborate in order to succeed, no excuses, and that is what is about as important as the music itself. While this is definitely not their music, they reportedly react very positively and have eventually started to bring forth sometimes very unexpected songs of their own that they want to perform and they put effort into it. They have definitely widened their horizon. My friend is understandably proud of that.

Thinking of that, they wouldn't ever get exposed to that (filth, yuck) with god fearing home schooling parents who'd rather put blinkers on them.

 

My first several years I had great teachers all the way through, and I learned a ton, from beavers (we had dams nearby) to volcanos to cursive writing. I was lucky. Unfortunately, after about 2nd grade, I can only think of a handful of such teachers. One in history, two in sciences, one in English, one in math. That's it, for about 10 years. If that's the standard odds, I'd rather give them my passion for learning than give them tiny odds of occassionally seeing someone else's.

 

I don't think that what we've been referring to is really needed once you move to higher education. It's a means to an end after all so that kids can get interested. Most kids are not interested that much by what is compulsory and find a real incentive in learning about stuff that doesn't really fit in the school system. But as they get older I've noticed that unfortunately it's the kids themselves who often become "all business" so that the odd teacher is probably going to be considered like some sort of weirdo à la Dead Poets Society. Furthermore it's always a very subjective thing. Some kids will rave about a teacher while others will hate the same teacher sometimes for the very same reasons.

 

True, but then we're talking about lower education anyway. I can understand a lot of parents becoming much less confident in their educational abilities once the high-school level is reached.

 

Oh yeah, once you get into high school it would get ridiculously difficult. Yeah, my wife or I can teach our child how to add, subtract, multiply, and divide, but lets just say it's been about 10 years since I've had to do calculus, and I'm not sure how up to snuff I am with it. Heck, my wife is an elementary school teacher by trade, and I doubt she would trust herself beyond the first few years of our son's education.

 

I could do high-school math, physics, history, english, government, and PE, but chemistry and biology would start to get dicey. I don't happen to have any tables I could burn methyl alcohol on, or any methyl alcohol for that matter. I don't have a fume hood, and I'm afraid if I let them disect a frog I'd have PETA on me.

 

Ultimately, I think one of the big underlying problems is that the kids that cause problems in public or private schools are likely to not have the right families for homeschooling either, and the ones who can get more that way will most likely get more out of school too.

@ NOG: well, methyl alcohol should be available commercially, so that's the least of your problems. Now, dissection could get a little tricky... I doubt PETA cares that much about frogs, but when you get to mammals they might be a little testy. BTW, I remember that in an introductory biology course in university the Biology I students had to dissect fish, and afterwards the assistants offered them to take the fish away and cook it if they were interested. Probably you could make do with some fresh fish from the local store. I doubt they sell frogs though - maybe in France?

I wondered if I could go into education, but truth be told I don't think I'm good enough for it. I wonder how my sister would do - she studied linguistics and English in university, and from then it's very, very hard not to become an English teacher .

 

Bah, forget the store, we'll get the fresh fish fresh! Field trip and disection on the beach! You're a genius, Shaman!

 

Actually no, sorry to disappoint you but we only eat legs and they're quite expensive. It's really a delicacy.

 

Of course you only eat the legs, but those legs were originally attached to a frog, right? You don't need the legs for the disection process. Most of the interesting stuff is in the body of the frog. It would seem like if it is relatively easy (albeit expensive) to purchase frog legs, that there has to be some place where you can buy cheap quadra-amputeed frogs.

 

Anyone can do the same because there is no standard, at least not in Texas. Every homeschooler here claims he/she can do the same as you, NOG. And much like your claim, there are no competency standards that one has to demonstrate to be able to home school his/her kids. Everyone is an expert, but none of them have any credentials in those areas. At least real teachers have done the work and have at least a four-year degree in an area of specialization. These lazy hicks here "claim" they can teach their kids anything a real teacher can. I'm glad it's not my kids they are teaching....

 

While I am a strong supporter of public schools, this is probably because I have no interest in being a teacher. However, I think the villification of people who choose to home school is way overboard. A quick Google search sent me here which although I'm sure they are biased numbers seems to imply that home schooled children seem to be doing quite well.

 

Personally I believe it's more dangerous to have parents who do not teach at all.

I have met a surprising amount of parents who take no interest in their childs education for reasons such as "I don't understand it, myself." or "It's the teachers job, not mine." teachers and parents do not communicate effectively - if a teacher had a problem with my performance at school it was brought up at the end of the year in a school report, or at the end of term at a parents evening.

If a parent has the will and energy to support a child through home schooling, I think they're more than likely to perform just as well at a public or private school (obvious reasoning withstanding) as they would get the support they require after hours as well.

Schools are relatively insular in what they share with people not on the staff. Resources are shown to the students now and then - but very little is shared with parents, I would always read outside of my basic curriculum up until my mid teens, my mother, if she had time would assist me and would find resources elsewhere.

Surely the system would function a lot more effectively if responsibility was upon both the teacher and the parent? Rather than a my job/your job view?