Persecuted Germans find political asylum in the US

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Baden-Württemberg is a wealthy state, and their rather well funded schools have a good reputation in Germany. Largely due to the presence of US troops US evangelicals have influence there. It isn't that the Romeikes didn't have options, they just weren't good enough for them. Given their fundamentalist views and their advisers, it is unlikely that they had a constructive attitude in their dealing with the authorities. So I feel not embarrassed in the slightest. That these obstructionists didn't get their way is reassuring to me.

The point aside that evangelicals used the case to create a precedent aside, good riddance. They are in a better world now, so let me rephrase that old slogan:

Give me your tired, your hungry, your poor - and your nutty​

 

We got a few weirdos like that here as well, both of the christian and muslim kind that are unhappy with the curriculum in Swedish schools, private or public. Think we could ship them over to the states? I know there are many muslim parents who are aghast at the mandatory, mixed gender swimming education here. Possible for them to get asylum in the more tolerant society across the pond?

 

Just out of curiosity, Ragusa, what 'other options' did they have? The article makes it look like they could either accept the public school system or leave, and they left.

 

We do have religious schools here, you know. We have catholic schools here and various protestant schools; not all of them require fees. These weren't good enough options for them.

Oh, and on second thought, of course, they could have compromised, but that presumably would go against the very essence of what fundamentalism is about.

 

Ah, ok, I was under the impression from the article that those were not an option by law as well. I see re-reading it that it's only homeschooling that's banned. I have a question, though. If the authority of the court can go as far as removing children from the parents' home in order to prevent the 'formation of "parallel societies" based on religion or worldview', why allow religious schools? Wouldn't that run the same risk of the same thing?

 

Because religious schools still expose the children, as required under the law, to other religions and political ideas albeit with an emphasis on the own religious message. The general idea is that exposure to other world views and ideas and religious education can be reconciled, a notion that Mr. and Mrs. Romeike refused to accept.

As an example: In a catholic school children are taught creation - in religious studies. They are also taught evolution - in biology classes. I think that puts both subjects in their proper place. That is so even in public schools, even though there children/parents can choose whether they kids attend religious studies or not.

 

One of the biggest douchebags I ever knew was homeschooled because his parents felt that the public system "was geared for the dumbest kid in the class". The arrogance and sense of superiority coming off this piece of crap was truly astounding. However, one encounter is not enough to base an entire opinion on.

The one line that I found telling here was that these people wanted home schooling without government intervention. It's that last part that concerns me. We have lots of folks here in Canada who are home schooled for a variety of reasons. The idea is that the parent does the teaching and the school boards and other entitites ensure that what is being taught is not at horrid variance from the proscribed curriculum. I have no problem with that idea. But the idea of schooling occuring in complete isolation from a public standard makes me . . . uncomfortable.

 

Don't worry, LKD, that's the way it works in the US, too. Or at least, from what I hear.

 

Since the article is a translation to english, I'm curious as to what "tone" it was meant to be written in. The way I read it, it seems to be implying that there is something wrong with the Romeikes for wanting to home school their children and fleeing Germany to do so.

I am a strong supporter of our public school system and Teen Snook is in the system, but I don't understand why there is such vitriol against people who choose to home school. As long as a child receives an education that prepares them adulthood what is the big deal? I guess the answer is that some people believe that the minimum requirements include things that others don't.

 

The running theory is that home schooling is 'socially stunting' and in some situations where parents of opposed idealogies to the general population can create a dissenting group of youths who get into trouble in later life or struggle to accept others. There are also arguments that parents won't adjust appropriately to a childs age - while a child is around others of similar age they tend to develop at a similar rate - homeschooling leaves a child developing differently which can put strain on the parent/child relationship as well as social skills required later on in life when interacting with like aged peers.

I still regret I wasn't homeschooled for at least a while. As it was my mother had to work instead, was a rough few years in school - and half of it was just the teachers!

 

Rules for homeschooling varies from state to state.

In some places they can be very loose.

I think, and maybe I'm wrong, that government monitoring of homeschooling is largely nonexistent.

With homeschooling you can get very well educated children whose parents really make sure they learn a lot (more academics than a good public school) and very poorly educated children (maybe ideology, but little in the way of academics).

The results can be at each end depending on how you define learning.

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Where your teachers uncaring or hardheaded? If not what was the problem?

 

A couple were bullies, plain and simple, the special needs teacher would speak loudly about "she doesn't need to use crutches, she's putting it on." had one teacher drag me to the church next door (church school, only decent school in the area - there was one other and it was... poor.) for overhearing I was interested in dungeons and dragons and refusing to conform to the proper ideology.

Interestingly I got along best with the RE and science teachers, I could hold a (relatively) eloquent and reasoned debate, and in the RE case, interesting oppositional views.

I was raised a Christian, though have never followed the faith myself, my mother would also attend synagogue when she lived in the cities as she wasn't entirely sure either Judaism or Christianity had it quite right. I also would read more outside of lessons so covering other faiths I would be able to have useful input and various alternative views.

 

My sympathies. If that is what the better school in the area is like that sounds pretty bad.

Doesn't need the crutches????!!!!!!!!! No this &*(@ing cast on my leg is a fashion statement. That response would have gotten her in more trouble but it would've been deserved.

I one of my younger sisters had a piano teacher who was worried about D&D and gave her pamphlets letting her know how it was going to encourage devil worship amongst the other bits of nonsense.

But I'm lucky, about the worst few teachers (one of the more anal out of the mostly friendly group of science teachers there) I had was one that held me responsible for a desk someone else broke. Got along with most of my religious teachers too-still remember 1 of them standing on a stool and shaking another one at us as he preached at us while we left due to the class ending. Most of my religious teachers were friendly though (one played part of the Life of Brian in class), the exception was one that struck me taking what sounded like an interesting class at first down the this is the devil manipulating the world route or something like that.... this teacher even played an episode of the Pagan Invasion (you may be able to find it on VCY) in class.

I guess I'm pretty lucky.

 

Ragusa, I gotta say that the tone of the translated article (assuming that its tone parallels the tone of the untranslated article), as well as your own comments, sound quite intolerant of Christians. BTW, note that I'm a non-religious person, but I'm tolerant of those who are.

Forcing parents to send their children to schools they believe to be teaching stuff that's contrary to their own beliefs? Courts saying that children can be taken from their families if they don't allow their kids to be brainwashed with the government approved "world view"?

My gawd, for a country that is supposedly very anti-Nazi, it sounds like there's a particularly virulent form of anti-religious fascism infesting Germany currently, and perhaps much of Europe as well, given that the "European Court of Human Rights" seems to hold these same views.

 

That's the running arguement, but it's also a load of in most cases. Study after study has found that the average home-schooled child (at least in the US) develops on par with their peers socially, and usually better educationally. The reason is simple: these kids don't generally live in isolation on some farm somewhere, but instead see plenty of social activity through group sports like soccer or hockey and other activities. The stereotype of the home-schooled kid living in complete isolation from their peers is, while not impossible, largely a myth.

Crucis, don't be too harsh on Germany. The culture has always been very rule-bound and conformist. It's just they way their culture developed. It was taken advantage of during WWII, sure, but it's led to plenty of it's own advantages throughout their history.

 

I'm glad we have your absolution.

crucis,
seeing you blather about nazis and enforcing conformity, let me just say this, very briefly: You're clueless. Very much so.

And off I go to complete ME1 so I can import my character into ME2 since I lost my saves during my last crash

 

And you're just another stunningly offensive europeon who spews anti-religious insults left and right... (well, mostly left).

I'd say that you're the clueless one, given that the article you quoted positively SCREAMED enforced conformity!

Nothing says brainwashing like "we will take away your children if you don't accept the government approved world view"!!! What's next? Will children be taken from their parents if the parents refuse to accept this globalony warming/climate change conjob? Will the children be taken away if the parents refuse to renounce pro-life views? Will the children be taken away if the parents refuse to renounce religion entirely?

 

This is impressive crucis, I think you have managed to post both the most offensive and most ignorant post ever to have graced this board. Congratulations!

 

That's certainly a matter of opinion. I find this stance of the German government vis-a-vis home schooling and Ragusa's anti-religious attitude (i.e.
"Give me your tired, your hungry, your poor - and your nutty") pretty ..... offensive!!!