Haiti Earthquake.

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I'm surprised no one started a thread here. Last I checked, 75,000 people have been confirmed dead and buried in mass graves. The infrastructure of this, one of the world's poorest, weakest nations, has been shattered. Help is pouring in. I made a small donation today, and will be donating more once I get my paycheque. My only concern is that with all the corruption there and within aid agencies, will the donations actually GET to these unfortunate souls who need it?

 

I think there is a way to find out what % of your donation goes to helping. A few charities say they are going to try for 100% but 90%+ is generally considered good as far as I know.

I am sure there are groups that tell you which charities are worthwhile. I think the better business bureau or some similar organization (consumer reports?) may help.

 

WTF, why?

Hope they aren't taking up transport space where something ... I dunno - useful - could be being sent over.

 

Yeah, Aik, that's a pretty stupid thing to send. Send one preacher and it'll be better, and take up less space!

It's amazing some of the survival stories coming out of Haiti these past few days, though. It's just a pitty there aren't more of them.

 

LKD,

The best way to make sure most of your donation is actually going to do some good, send your donation to some first-rate highly regarded aid organization, like the Red Cross for example. It is rare for any charity to spend 100% of donations on direct help, as all charities have support costs, and not everyone can donate their time for free. As long as you stick to some reputable aid organization, the lion's share of your donation should go to actually helping people.

 

While looking things up, I found this site which rates charities, including a search feature. After googling some Haiti relief efforts:

World Vision: 86.7% program efficiency (amount of a donation spent on charity)

Red Cross: 90.1%

Catholic Relief Services: Insufficient Information (religious groups aren't required to file form 990)

UNICEF: 90.5%

CARE: 90.3%

Operation Blessing: 99.1%!!

My church is located just down the road from the Operation Blessing headquarters, so our pastor told us not to take a collection, but rather to give to them, since they could do more with it than we could ourselves. It's good to see his advice was sound.

All of those numbers are very impressive, but I'm guessing religious organizations will be moreso simply because of the likelyhood of donated services (administration, distribution, packaging, whatever).

 

Looking at the link Aikanaro posted you've got to wonder what is wrong with the people who can plan things like that. I loathe proselytism, especially when it's trying to take advantage of someone's suffering.

Better yet, send some doctors and nurses... that would be more useful than some religious nutjob preaching about Christ's second coming.

I second that. Besides the Red Cross is non religious so they don't preach.

 

What a total dippoop. When he faces God, I think the conversation is not going to be a pleasant one for him.

 

He might face Damballa or Baron Samedi instead...

That will certainly be an unpleasant conversation....

 

I tried looking up Catholic Relief Services on the website NOG and it just didn't list them (searched for both the full name and the abbreviation).

This is what the BBB says. I'm not sure how the two sites are different in terms of how they find financial info.

http://www.bbb.org/charity-reviews/national/religious/catholic-relief-services-in-baltimore-md-475

 

I think people overreact to Pat Robertson. The bad stuff makes the news, but the good stuff never does, and he's done plenty. Remember, he founded Operation Blessing.

Actually, most of the missionaries out there these days, especially the ones that go to disaster zones or 3rd world contries, are trained doctors, nurses, or relief workers themselves. They witness while they work, so you get two for the price of one (actually, less, since they're donating their work).

I don't know, maybe they gave BBB the information freely, while the other site relies on tax records? Either way, 93% is also pretty darn good.

 

You think that is bad? Danny Glover thinks it is because everyone doesn't believe in global warming.

 

But why do the Haitians need missionaries at all? The island is roughly split in half from the colonial powers that previously occupied it. Haiti is the French half, and the Dominican Republic is the Spanish half. Both were Catholic nations, and through previous missionary work, the majority of Haitians today are already Catholic. I looked up the demographics, and the bulk of those who aren't Catholic follow one of the Protestant denominations. They aren't a bunch of godless heathans.

As for Pat Robertson, while he has done good, he is a total crank and completely out of line to suggest that Haiti got hit by an earthquake because of a deal with the devil they made back in the early 1800s. That's about as asinine as you can get. There's no historical evidence of that happening, but even if there was, everyone involved in this "deal" - along with all their grandchildren - are long since dead. I think he has to come out every few years (remember this is the same guy who said Hurricane Katrina was also divine punishment) just to assure everyone he's still a complete loon.

 

Yeah, I don't really think they should let Pat speak in public any more.

As for why missionaries:
1.) Catholicism may be the official religion, but Voodoo is the national religion.
2.) To convert those godless catholics to true worship
3.) To show the love of God. Even fellow Christians need this.

 

Exactly.

It may also be argued that even if they were heathens their culture and beliefs should be deemed worthy of respect.

I don't resent people having faith and wanting to help others. I just think that this help should come without any strings attached. If you help someone while having an agenda involving converting that person to your belief then IMO you're just trying to benefit from that person's plight to get what you want.

Missionaries believe they save souls while helping the bereft but I find the very premise behind this to be utterly wrong. If somebody shows interest in your belief and you're willing to share this belief with that person it's fine but forcing your own faith down someone's throat is another matter.

You're just making my point.

1) it means disrespect for other sets of belief.
2) why would Protestantism be any better than Catholicism or any other creed?
3) they don't need missionaries to teach them how to pray.

 

I think NOG was doing that a little tongue-in-cheek. He almost certainly looked at the link I provided, and saw that only 1.5% of Haitians actually practice voodoo, Catholics are Christians, so he certainly doesn't think their "godless", and point 3 was the only one where he was serious.

 

Actually, I'm about 1/2 serious. While only 1.5% may officially be followers of Voodoo, a lot of Voodoo activity is reported by just about everyone who goes there. Perhaps some of this is actually some fusion of Catholicism and other beliefs, like Santaria (who often call themselves Catholics), but they're distinctly not Christian. As for respecting other religions, I respect their right to choose, but I also respect my (and the preachers') right to persuade, especially with love and compasion.

As for the Catholics, Catholic teaching is wildly different from Protestant teaching, to the point that many Catholic priests don't even believe Christ is the only and complete way to Heaven. Official doctrine says you don't go to Heaven unless a certain set of rituals have been done over you, including Last Rights (which means if you die and there isn't a living, healthy Catholic priest nearby, you're screwed), and all but endorses worship of the Saints in place of Christ (expressly forbidden in the Bible). Many Catholic believers and priests, especially in the US, kind of gloss over that and say it's more tradition than necessary ritual, but others follow them closely. Personally, I believe a great many Catholics will reach Judgement and be very surprised, and not happily. I also believe a great many will reach Judgement and only be surprised by those others who don't make it. Mind you, I believe similarly about most of the Protestant denominations, but here it's more a matter of people going to Church because it's tradition and calling themselves Christians, while not actually believing any of it.

Also mind you, I'm not about to judge who's who. That's just all the more reason to preach to everyone (especially if you're doing it while setting their legs, giving them food, etc.) just to make sure.

 

For someone who's not about to judge, it sure looks like you just did in the previous paragraph. So much for giving you the benefit of the doubt...

 

Actually NOG, I think what you said is the first time I've ever heard someone say that about Catholics and Last Rites.

And I've been in Catholic & Catholically educationed for years.

There is a list somewhere of what people have to believe to be Catholic but I've read it (no I don't remember all of it) but I am quite sure the Last Rites bit wasn't on it.

About praying to Saints. I'm sure there are some Catholics who do but if you actually read the songs and stuff said at a mass it says "pray for us" to the saints. It isn't a prayer to them but rather a request to them to pray for us. No the claim is not made that the Saints and/or Mary (whom this claim is also often made about) are gods.

I totally agree that there are a number of places where local religious practices were mixed with Catholicism. But that is more of a local situation and not Catholicsm is "pagan" as some Evangelical groups have defined it (and through it us) as.

I don't pass any of it off as "tradition" and I don't expect other Catholics to either.

What I would say is that there is a tradition among many Christian groups (mainly of the Evangelical variety) to say this about Catholics rather than that they are fellow Christians.

Part of it may be honest religious concerns or confusion (how can you say person X is important but not a "god"?)

And some of it may be to promote evangelizing (even to other Christians-join my church it is the only real Christian one).

And some of it may even date back to the fact that there was anti-Catholic bias (the KKK was against Jewish, Catholic, and Black people). Possibly because much of the early USA was Protestant (though Catholics have been here since the colonies time period).

Also there may be some fear that Rome is going to take over (after all there was a time when the Pope had much political power over European societies) that has dragged unnecessarily into the US-there were actual rumors JFK and Al Smith (a Catholic candidate for President within the Democratic party before him) were secretly going to be taking orders from the Pope.

Anyway that is some explanation/points I have and I hope it doesn't distract to much from the topic of Haiti and making sure the money sent to it actually helps people.