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What if...just what if...

Discussion in 'The Temple of Elemental Evil' started by Death Rabbit, Jun 5, 2003.

  1. Death Rabbit

    Death Rabbit Straight, no chaser Adored Veteran Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    ...this game ends up sucking?

    Sucks to think about it, but it just might. Nobody thought Pool of Radiance would be anything other than awesome, and look what happened. Arcanum was given editor's choice by PC gamer, and it barely sold at all and was extremely disappointing, IMO. Considering all the RPG's that have come out in the last few years that have been rather lackluster, and that the shadow of BG2 seems to loom over any new game that comes out, what if GH:ToEE ends up suffering the same fate? Will you buy it anyway? I don't want it to suck, because frankly I want some new blood here in the RPG world...but it's tough to ignore recent trends.

    Not really a 'glass is half empty' kinda guy usually, I promise.

    [ June 05, 2003, 05:50: Message edited by: Death Rabbit ]
     
  2. Ameorn Gems: 9/31
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    Well, i think everybody knows this Death Rabbit, but are ignoring it or hoping that it won't suck... I think most (including myself) just look at the good aspects of the game that are promised by troika and don't think about what could suck in the game. i really don't think anyone wants to get dissapointed again so they're just telling themseves that it will be great, period. well that's what i think anyway :hmm:
     
  3. Beren

    Beren Lovesick and Lonely Wanderer Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    I certainly hope Greyhawk fulfills my expectations. Comparisons to BG2 can be kind of unfair. I'm playing Wizardry 8 off and on, and I must say that I'm actually enjoying myself. Turn-based combat can be a good thing, if done well. So certainly I hope Greyhawk turns out well.

    But what I think I'll do is let the grapvine pass the verdict first. No more getting it off the shelf as soon as you see it, or buy it because one dweeb at a magazine who plays it only once said he enjoyed it. I'll let other gamers feel the water first.
     
  4. Faragon Gems: 25/31
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    What Beren described is my policy on any game. I went against it once, and what game did I end up with? Arcanum. :rolleyes:

    I try to keep my hopes down, and think that even if it's going to suck, I'll still have PnP :)
     
  5. Taluntain

    Taluntain Resident Alpha and Omega Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    Actually, I predicted that PoR will end up being a buggy piece of crap long before the game was released... I remember discussing it with BTA. And I was right...

    But I don't see ToEE ending the same way. I think way more effort & experience was put into this game. Troika isn't counting just on the name to sell the game, like Stormfront did with PoR.
     
  6. Astin X Gems: 6/31
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    It is however using the same equation:
    *Using an existing module
    *Using a new ruleset for the first time in a crpg
    *Turn based combat(PoR arrgh!)

    On the up side:
    *Good feat and skills implementation
    *Character interaction
    *Item Creation
    *Good graphics (as far as I can see)

    I'll wait and see, but I do admit that the anticipation is building.
     
  7. Late-Night Thinker Gems: 17/31
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    I will say this...

    Based on transcripts from IRC chats and such the developers seem like funny and charming people...

    How much is that really worth?

    Probably more than you would think...
     
  8. Taluntain

    Taluntain Resident Alpha and Omega Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    Well, at least they're not leaving out half of the stuff (rules, classes, etc.) like the PoR team did, and then whine about not having enough money to do it whenever they were asked why they didn't implement even all of the most basic things.
     
  9. Greenlion420 Gems: 8/31
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    Most of you know i'm "on the fence" when it comes to POR. However i'm hoping GH ToEE will perfect the turn based combat system. the only problem i had with said system in POR, was the time factor of all the different animations. they were well put together and nice to look at but, it made every damn battle last forever. If ToEE can overcome that, then i have no problem with a turn based combat system. as i've said before I think it gives you more time to plan your actions, taking some of the "hack'n'slash" factor out of the game. I just want the game released so we can try it.
     
  10. Ferrick Gems: 1/31
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    [​IMG] I think a major point needs to be remembered when putting PoR2 and ToEE in the same breath and that is, PoR2 went through several different developer hands before it was published. Little wonder PoR2 was such a mess. ToEE on the other hand has been with the same developer since its inception. I just hope Troika learned their lesson from the criticism about Arcanum. This is the one thing that worries me: Will Troika get it right. I love the Greyhawk setting and I am hoping with all get out that ToEE does for Greyhawk what BG1 did for Forgotten Realms. Still, I share some of Death Rabbit's concern.
     
  11. Errol Gems: 23/31
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    [​IMG] From what I know about Troika, and what they've said to me on the Greyhawk Inn boards, they are doing everything they can to make this a great game.

    I have great faith in these guys, they really seem to know what they're doing; and like it at the same time.
     
  12. Greenlion420 Gems: 8/31
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    I'm just a little afraid of getting another Arcanum. that game was, well, just crappy.
    As long as it's nowhere near Arcanum, then i'm sure it'll be good.
     
  13. Death Rabbit

    Death Rabbit Straight, no chaser Adored Veteran Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    I'll probably still buy it, but I've learned a few lessons:

    1. I will NOT trust PC Gamer's rating of the game, unless all the other PC mags and sites share the sentiment.

    2. I'll wait at least a month before buying. I figure by then a patch will have been released to take care of any major bugs, if any.

    3. As I'm sure there'll be a pantload of threads here discussing the game, I'll keep my ear to the boards to get a good idea of whether or not it's worth it. No more game buying without a little marketing research.

    I'm actually very optimistic at this point. :)
     
  14. Laches Gems: 19/31
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    Huh, I really liked Arcanum. Know lots of people who did too. Actually, I never even realized so many disliked it until reading this thread. Just goes to show.... something I'm sure.

    Couldn't stand POR2 though so give me that.
     
  15. Frog Gems: 12/31
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    Arcanum wasn't that bad, but it certainly wasn't anything to get happy about, let alone great. It had some nice stuff in it, just the combat system and some annoying little things kinda killed it before it could really take off. I bought it for $20.00 so I think I got my moneys worth.

    ToEE looks a lot better than Arcanum ever did. The combat looks perfected, the design and graphics - mucho better. And the subject matter is more appealing overall. I think we may have a winner.
     
  16. Alyr Arkhon Gems: 10/31
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    I agree with Taluntain, it was foreseen, that PoR will be a bad game, and I wasn't disappointed. But I liked Arcanum very much: the graphics were not that good (they were poor in fact), but the story and the gameplay was great. If Troika can improve the graphics - and as far as I've seen they can - and they can guarantee the same quality in the story and the gameplay, then this will be a very good game, better than Neverwinter nights.
     
  17. Foradasthar Gems: 21/31
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    In my very humble opinion, not much is required to make it better than NWN. :)
     
  18. Juevon Gems: 1/31
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    "In my very humble opinion, not much is required to make it better than NWN"

    *Raises his glass to Foradasthar*

    Im not a big NWN fan either.

    Back on topic... I like to think that Im pretty open minded when it comes to new games and I try to stay away from the whole comparison thing when possible.

    That being said...when a company tries to make its name in a genre that includes some of the best games, ever, for the PC, that company has a tough road ahead of itself.

    Being a Turn based D&D game, TtoEE will inevitably be compared, for better or worse, with both the Baldur's Gate series AND the Fallout series.

    While this may not be fair, it will be nearly impossible not to, being that the bar has been set so high in both genres.

    Its been a while since a great game has found its way onto my hard drive, so heres to hoping!
     
  19. Demogorog Gems: 4/31
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    I'm really looking forward to Greyhawk: ToEE, can't see why it would turn up to be something really lousy.

    Together with Lionheart and Starwars: Knights of the Old Republic, it will be one of the best CRPGs since BG2. I hope that at least one of those three games will beat Divine Divinity.
     
  20. rastilin Gems: 8/31
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    I agree with Gopher on this one, I also have faith that the game will turn out fine.

    My main quibble with pool of radiance was that there were simply too many graphics, everything stood out, it's like looking at a long series of boxy paintings. That and the fact that combat was boring.
     
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