1. SPS Accounts:
    Do you find yourself coming back time after time? Do you appreciate the ongoing hard work to keep this community focused and successful in its mission? Please consider supporting us by upgrading to an SPS Account. Besides the warm and fuzzy feeling that comes from supporting a good cause, you'll also get a significant number of ever-expanding perks and benefits on the site and the forums. Click here to find out more.
    Dismiss Notice
Dismiss Notice
You are currently viewing Boards o' Magick as a guest, but you can register an account here. Registration is fast, easy and free. Once registered you will have access to search the forums, create and respond to threads, PM other members, upload screenshots and access many other features unavailable to guests.

BoM cultivates a friendly and welcoming atmosphere. We have been aiming for quality over quantity with our forums from their inception, and believe that this distinction is truly tangible and valued by our members. We'd love to have you join us today!

(If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact us. If you've forgotten your username or password, click here.)

The 5 Hardest battles

Discussion in 'BG2: Throne of Bhaal (Classic)' started by Advanced Simplicity, Aug 31, 2004.

  1. Advanced Simplicity Gems: 4/31
    Latest gem: Sunstone


    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2004
    Messages:
    80
    Likes Received:
    0
    [​IMG] Which battles would you rate as the top 5 hardest?
    Tactics,ascension and whatever other battles-mods you have.

    I've never finished ToB with Ascension, but I am halfway through now, and i've played from SoA, with all Tactics components installed.

    Here's my list:

    1. Improved Illich

    2.Pontifex the yellow sand dragon (I just
    couldn't find out how to hust this guy)

    3.Improved Irenicus

    4.Improved Bodhi (with undead Sola)

    5.Kuuroisan, The Acid Kensai

    Well, my list is kinda incomplete since i've yet to fight some of the toughest battles (or at least i've heard that they're som of the toughest, like The Eclipse, Ascension Final battle, Improved, Yagashura, Abazigal, Baltazhaar etc) But i'm racing through it now and will update. Would be interesting to see what lists those of you who have done all battles will look like.
     
  2. chevalier

    chevalier Knight of Everfull Chalice ★ SPS Account Holder Veteran

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2002
    Messages:
    16,809
    Media:
    11
    Likes Received:
    55
    Gender:
    Male
    Can't think of anything specific right now, but those most probably wouldn't be any storyline-important battles, but some random enemies giving me lots of grief because of inconvenient immunities or abilities they have. When you play the game for the Nth time, the major battles get routinised. You just know how to do that and you don't care much - after all, you've already finished the game and there isn't much stress anymore. Random encounters, however, can still be supremely annoying if you aren't prepared.
     
  3. Eric Xanthus Gems: 10/31
    Latest gem: Zircon


    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2004
    Messages:
    385
    Likes Received:
    0
    I agree with Chevalier, for the most part. Illych was thrilling the first two times I did it, but now I know exactly how to handle it. Undead Bodhi w/Solaufein is still a pretty tough battle, as is the Ritual dragon. The first time Kuroisan attacked me I accidentally hit upon a semi-cheese defense, which made me kinda sad. Improved Irenicus is more about endurance than anything else. The only battle I still think of as quite difficult is Improved Abazigail, which always gives me some trouble--all those wing buffets going off makes it hard to do anything. I'll twist your question and name five battles I found exciting and difficult the first time I fought them

    Improved Illych
    Improved Bodhi w/Solaufein
    The lich guardians above Kangaxx
    Pontifex and his &%&^%&^! golems
    Improved Mae'Var

    Archryssa coming after Solaufein would make this list too, because it happened seconds after I disrupted the ritual and my whole team was exhausted. That was a one on one battle for the ages, but in itself not too difficult. And the Eclipse battle ended with a fizzle, because I had (ducks head in shame) 3 sorcerers + Imoen and I forgot they were all packing my offensive CC of 3xADHW. My change of pace answer for toughest battle: Korgan, Viconia, Yoshimo and my Assassin, straight out Jon's dungeon, getting the book of Kaza. That first room of improved undead is wicked.
     
  4. Foradasthar Gems: 21/31
    Latest gem: Pearl


    Joined:
    May 17, 2002
    Messages:
    1,332
    Likes Received:
    0
    Don't use tactics since I don't like cheating computer opponents, no matter how easy the game was otherwise. All of the enemies are pretty much child's play now that I've played the game through many enough times to know what's needed for what. I've Ascension installed though, save the improved Abazigal and improved firegiantbhaalspawnwhatever (forgot his name). I left out those two due to the heavy bugs caused by way too many spells and enemies at the same time.

    But from my first times playing through, that would be in order of relative difficulty the first time I fought them, not the order of appearance (how many times I died against each, that is):

    - Ascension's final battle in ToB
    - Irenicus on the Tree of Life
    - Demogorgon
    - Illithids in their Underdark base
    - Firkraag
     
  5. Kam Gems: 15/31
    Latest gem: Waterstar


    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2002
    Messages:
    763
    Likes Received:
    0
    Improved Abazigal?!?!?! I haven't even tried that one, since regular Abazigal still royally whips me almsot every single time I fight him.

    In no particular order:

    Undead Solafein+Improved Bhodi+Improved Undead(+four party members)= Ouch!

    Improved Sahuagin City. It's a good kind of hard that takes real strategy and careful use of spells.

    The seal guardians right before Demogorgon. If you take them all on without resting (the only way to do it), I'd say they're harder then Demo.

    The Death Knights in the Tuo Koa city.

    The final battle in Ascension.


    I never really had any trouble with any of the fights against Irenicus, either at the Tree of Life, or in Hell.

    edit: Abazigal? Ooops, I meant Draconis. :o Abazigal is cake.

    [ August 31, 2004, 17:49: Message edited by: Kam ]
     
  6. Wordplay Gems: 29/31
    Latest gem: Glittering Beljuril


    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2002
    Messages:
    3,453
    Likes Received:
    1
    All from the original game, as I find all modded battles ridicilous (double triggers, instant spells, immunities to everything, "teleport without error", crap like that).

    1) The hardest battle without doubt: Abazigal's son, at the gate of his lair. That invisibility + non-detection combo is a tought nut to crack, since his level has been beefed up so high that dispel magic fails 75% of time. Even though the battle is at the border AD&D rules, I still found it acceptable and fun. :)

    2) Watcher's Keep Blood War demons, especially the latter ones. Dead-magic room just before, dispelling ALL magic you might have had, and automatically hostile creatures; quite difficult without Time-Stop, especially since the game spawns 2 assassins right behind you (effectively killing your mages in one hit, if you get unlucky).

    3) Demi-lich in WK. Not as difficult as irritating. Instant-death without any chance to defend against it and only 3 seconds to react. Damn annoying. :nolike:

    All others are more or less easy to deal with. Mages get skeleton warriors and melee enemies get magical swords; easy as pie. ;)
     
  7. chevalier

    chevalier Knight of Everfull Chalice ★ SPS Account Holder Veteran

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2002
    Messages:
    16,809
    Media:
    11
    Likes Received:
    55
    Gender:
    Male
    Guess there's a reason why there's no Improved Draconis mod :shake: :lol:
     
  8. Evil Dad Gems: 15/31
    Latest gem: Waterstar


    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2003
    Messages:
    740
    Likes Received:
    1
    From what I've played so far it has to be ...

    1. Improved Faldorn (if you are a Druid anyway)
    2. Improved Illyich

    the rest haven't been too bad so far and I haven't got to Improved Bodhi to comment yet.
     
  9. Menathor Gems: 1/31
    Latest gem: Turquoise


    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2004
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hmm, have you ppl been playing too many mods? What are those Improved Monster versions? I think I have heard some of those in mod descriptions but other than that I got no idea O_o. Anyway the hardest battles for me are:

    1. Kangaxx Demi-Lich (REALLY nice award though)
    2. Firkraag (its just some lower resistance + magic missiles & the like really)
    3. Demogorgon (omg seer power)
    4. Greater Werewolf Boss in Shadows Over Shoubar
    5. hmm dunno

    Irenicus & other story must-fight bosses were SO silly. Hehe.
     
  10. Eric Xanthus Gems: 10/31
    Latest gem: Zircon


    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2004
    Messages:
    385
    Likes Received:
    0
    I'm a little confused. How is Firkraag one of the five hardest battles if you can kill him with "just some lower resistance + magic missiles & the like really?"
     
  11. Ziad

    Ziad I speak in rebuses Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2004
    Messages:
    4,088
    Media:
    57
    Likes Received:
    47
    My personal selection, with no mods installed. In no particular order:
    - Guardians of the Seal (WK level 5)
    - Demogorgon
    - Draconis
    - Abazigal
    I'm convinced those are far more difficult than the "standard" TOB ending.

    I don't use Tactics, and never tried the "Improved" components for the Bhaalspawns, but with mods I'd have to add the following:
    - Sureblade in Shadows over Soubar
    - Ascension ending (*insanely* difficult. I think the impossibility to win stems from how slow my PC is :( )

    Oh yes, and the first time I fought the Shadow Dragon, back when I hadn't developed any cheesy tactic, and I was fresh out of Chateau Irenicus... my second quest in chapter 2! It was immensely satisfying though.
     
  12. Col. Bruce Hampton Retired Gems: 3/31
    Latest gem: Lynx Eye


    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2004
    Messages:
    59
    Likes Received:
    0
    That is fine if you hate crap like that, but it is ridiculous to say that "all modded battles" are like that. Many mods improve enemy intelligence and re-instate abilities that they were supposed to have in the original game (or in D&D) but never used due to bugs in the original BG2 scripting.

    Generalizations like that are just keeping you from playing some truly challenging battles.

    All of the best and hardest battles I have fought come from the Tactics mod. Some of them use cheese, some do not. For me Improved Faldorn was impossible to be legitly (you fight her unarmed and solo), and Improved Bodhi was extremely difficult. Improved Firkragg was also very hard because he targets Player 1 viscously. Those battles were all so difficult that I don't list them with the FUN hard battles I've fought, which included....

    -- 3 dragons in The Darkest Day: Jarlaxle quest. With Tactics Smarter Dragons to enhance them. A Bronze, a Gold, and the toughest: a Draco-Lich!

    --Improved Sahaugin City... "the good kind of hard". Very strategic and scarey and fun.

    --Improved Undead room before you get to Samia in Firkragg's dungeons.

    --Improved Undead village in the 2nd underground level of Unseeing Eye quest.

    --Improved Druid's Grove except for Faldorn (this wasn't all that hard, but was really fun and took a lot of time to complete.)

    --Those dark knights someone else mentioned, near Demogorgon I think they were.

    There are others but those are a few tough fights!
     
  13. Wordplay Gems: 29/31
    Latest gem: Glittering Beljuril


    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2002
    Messages:
    3,453
    Likes Received:
    1
    @ Col. Bruce Hampton, Retired

    I say "all" because there really is just one mod that allows you to alter the monsters, and that one is Tactics. Unfortunately it concentrates on beefing them up with all kinds of cheese and other stuff I have already mentioned. Until another mod comes around that makes the monsters use different tactics (by AD&D rules and fitting to the game), I can honestly say that 'all modded battles ARE crap' -even the altered boss-battles made by David Gaider.

    To give you an example (try to guess who I mean):

    - She has a bow with unlimited ammo.
    - The arrows hit 100% sure, 5 times per round.
    - Every hit inflicts ~25 points of damage, dispels all magic without fail, lowers resistance and has a knock-back effect similar to wing-buffet. Also, they have a chance to insta-kill.
    - This female enemy can also cast spells like invisibility and teleport at will. Her walking speed is like with Boots of Speed. Also, she can cast Heal at lowered casting time.
    - Last hint: you meet her in ToB.

    Any guesses?

    [ September 01, 2004, 01:17: Message edited by: Wirhe ]
     
  14. Benan Gems: 20/31
    Latest gem: Garnet


    Joined:
    May 29, 2003
    Messages:
    1,220
    Likes Received:
    0
    Without mods

    1. The Gaurdians of the seal with the Marilith
    2. The Demon Wraith
    3. Kangaax
    4. Draconis
    5. The Twisted Rune.
     
  15. Mayfairy Gems: 8/31
    Latest gem: Skydrop


    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2003
    Messages:
    263
    Likes Received:
    0
    I got some thief module thingies installed, and assasinating Aran Linvail in his own guild is hard as hell.

    I'm playing solo thief and those assassins and shadow thieves follow me even when I'm invisible/hiding/non-detectable.

    Fortunately I got staff of the magi and Use Any Item HLA. Otherwise I would have been toast. (Actually I was a couple of times even with it)

    Other battles haven't been that difficult. Though I haven't played ToB part too far ever. Somehow I always get bored and start a new game.
     
  16. Khazraj Gems: 20/31
    Latest gem: Garnet


    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2002
    Messages:
    1,257
    Likes Received:
    0
    I have found the final fight in Ascension so hard even of easy level that it takes the cake supremely. And the Improved Illyich was a mega pain and so I uninstalled it.
     
  17. Advanced Simplicity Gems: 4/31
    Latest gem: Sunstone


    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2004
    Messages:
    80
    Likes Received:
    0
    Well, tactics and ascension is really made for uber multi-player made parties. I mean , I often use tactics as a justifier to semi-cheesy tactics and powergaming parties, your opponent cheats so why the hell wouldn't you use every dirty trick in the book also? (without CHEATING ofcourse and cheese that is basicly cheat (like 100 singing bard clones))

    Have anyone beaten improved Demogorgon on Insane setting, I hear it's pretty tough..
     
  18. Ziad

    Ziad I speak in rebuses Veteran

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2004
    Messages:
    4,088
    Media:
    57
    Likes Received:
    47
    @Wirhe
    Easy guess. Improved Illasera :)
    (oh yes, I forgot to mention this in my post, that *is* the one and only Gaider improved boss that I tried. Probably the last ever, too)
     
  19. Wordplay Gems: 29/31
    Latest gem: Glittering Beljuril


    Joined:
    Oct 14, 2002
    Messages:
    3,453
    Likes Received:
    1
    And we have a winner. ;)

    Almost forgot to mention #4: that last party guarding the seal in WK (but not all, like mentioned before). This party has a elder beholder, vampire, drow, ranger, and other nasty stuff (that for some reason never misses). Mainly that beholder and ranger (*evil* ranger?) make it so hard, as they (yet again) never seem to miss. Plus, insta-death, insta-petrify, insta-paralyze, insta-fear, and insta-dispel-anti-magic spells five times in a round... Difficult, but with that diverse party I didn't find it unrealistic, being a role-player as I am).
     
  20. joacqin

    joacqin Confused Jerk Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2001
    Messages:
    6,117
    Media:
    2
    Likes Received:
    121
    Illasera is a bit ridicolous. I am trying to remember if I have ever beaten her legit. The times I have beaten her have been when I have gone through SoA and been above the SoA level cap and with access to timestop. She is possible if you have timestop but without that spell she is neigh on impossible. She is outright impossible with a new ToB character you havent SKed in any way.
     
Sorcerer's Place is a project run entirely by fans and for fans. Maintaining Sorcerer's Place and a stable environment for all our hosted sites requires a substantial amount of our time and funds on a regular basis, so please consider supporting us to keep the site up & running smoothly. Thank you!

Sorcerers.net is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to products on amazon.com, amazon.ca and amazon.co.uk. Amazon and the Amazon logo are trademarks of Amazon.com, Inc. or its affiliates.