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NFL comes to London

Discussion in 'Colosseum' started by Aldeth the Foppish Idiot, Oct 22, 2007.

  1. Aldeth the Foppish Idiot

    Aldeth the Foppish Idiot Armed with My Mallet O' Thinking Veteran

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    So, for the first time, the NFL will play a regular season game in Europe - London to be precise. This isn't the Double-A versino of NFL Europa either. This is pro players, in a game that counts in the standings. Wembley stadium is sold out for the event - that's over 90,000 tickets. The NFL is trying to go international. There was a game last year in Mexico City, and there are plans in the works for Toronto next year, and a game in China is almost a certainty next year as well. The biggest fan base in Europe of the NFL is in Germany (and that makes sense given NFL Europa's teams were all from Germany).

    I know American football will never replace football, but does the NFL in Europe have a chance?
     
  2. Barmy Army

    Barmy Army Simple mind, simple pleasures... Adored Veteran

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    They'll probably be a little splash about this one, because the people behind NFL are so determined that there will be, and it's the first game (as far as I'm aware) away from the States.

    I hope it doesn't get big in Europe. It's far too commercial, and I just don't like American sports at all. I don't know what it is about them. Just the whole razmataz. Singers and pop stars performing at games and stuff. All the fireworks, big flashy lights and big huboo. Not for me thanks, I want to watch a game with a few beers. From what I can tell anyway, half of them are pumped full of steriods and other drugs. 'Cheating drugs' don't see as big a taboo in America as other nations.

    There's a few young people 'into it', as in watch a few games on TV, but nobody plays it. There's no local leagues or any kind of playing areas for it at all. So no, I doubt it'll kick off at any size, any time in the 20 years.

    Plus, in the UK we've already got a similar game, but in a better form, rugby. Football will always be THE sport in the majority of the world. Mainly because of the simplicity of play (all you need is a ball) and the history of the sport (traditions, rivalries etc.).
     
  3. Aldeth the Foppish Idiot

    Aldeth the Foppish Idiot Armed with My Mallet O' Thinking Veteran

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    It's the first one in Europe - there have been games in Canada and Mexico - so it's the first one that's not being played on the North American continent.

    I don't get what you mean. I assure you that beer is the beverage of choice whether watching football from the stadium, bar, or couch.

    With football the steroid era was in the 80s into the early 90s. Players who get caught now on roids get a lengthy suspension for the 1st offense, and could be gone with the 2nd offense. That having been said, there are hormones such as HGH that players could be using that wouldn't show up in a urine test. Of course, I'm sure that cheaters aren't confined to American sports. Anytime you have an occupation (in this case professional athlete) where you can become fabulously wealthy there are always going to be people looking for an edge. Becoming just a little better at the highest levels of competition can be the difference between being a marginal player and a superstar.

    OK two more questions - how exactly is rugby "similar but in a better form" than football. If you're talking about the ball, I'll be inclined to agree. If you're talking about the sport, I won't.

    Also, what do you consider an American sport? Sports that started American or sports that have remained predominantly American? If the former that list would include baseball, football, and basketball. Plus a whole host of x-games and racing type sports. If you're talking about sports that are today still nearly exclusively American there isn't much - American football and that's about it. (I suppose NASCAR too, but I don't think driving should really be considered a sport.)
     
  4. Barmy Army

    Barmy Army Simple mind, simple pleasures... Adored Veteran

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    I just mean I want sports simple. I want to have a few beers, watch a match, have a few more beers and then do whatever. I don't want to see distracting women with pom-poms dancing, I don't want to see pop-stars or TV stars around the place. I don't want to see fireworks and lights. I don't want annoying people walking around trying to sell me popcorn and Coke. I want to go to the game with the lads half-pissed, shout a bit of light-hearted abuse and banter to the other set of fans, scream my head off for the team then go back to the pub and finish the session. American sports tend to have a 'big event' and 'fake' feel to them, where the fans don't really get involved all that much. Pretty much a similar set of reasons as to why I'm not overly fond of the Champions League/Premier League/Primera Liga/Serie A competitions (however, I do still enjoy these as they are football, and I live for it).

    There's never an excuse for taking any kind of performance enhancing drugs. I can't remember a single footballer who has been suspended/banned for using banned substances. Maybe I've just got a crap memory, but I can't remember a single one, and the random drug tests are plentiful. There's just no kind drug culture surrounding the game. It just wouldn't be stood for. You only have to LOOK at the worlds best players to realize they don't pump steriods or whatever.

    Eeeh, c'mon. It's an oval shaped ball, you either run with it or throw it to another guy, trying to touch it down on the oppositions end of the field. There's lots of similarities. Obviously differences in rukles, but of course there will be, the general gist is the same. But they're similar sports. The same reason I compare basketball to netball, and baseball to rounders ;) .

    Baseball, basketball, ice hockey and gridiron. They're the American sports I'm on about.

    Most important part of my post: I'm not trying to dig at your sports for the sake of it, I just don't like the whole culture around American football/sports. From a British football fan looking in, there doesn't seem to be a great deal 'personal' about them. I'm sure a lot of Americans would argue that. However, until you've been over here and been involved in my idea of football culture, it's hard to truly understand what I mean. Hang around with me and the lads for a few games at Chesterfield FC, (where you're literally feet away from the players on the pitch, and can regularly see and speak to around the town) and you'll start to realize what I'm getting at.
     
  5. Harbourboy

    Harbourboy Take thy form from off my door! Veteran

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    Sounds a bit like how the LA Galaxy are coming to play a game in New Zealand in December. It'll be sold out for sure, but what's the point really? We already have soccer here. We're no good at it, but having David Beckham come here and play one game isn't going to make us any better at it.
     
  6. Aldeth the Foppish Idiot

    Aldeth the Foppish Idiot Armed with My Mallet O' Thinking Veteran

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    Wow. I assumed that sports in England were just as commercialized and over-hyped as they were over here. You mean there's no such thing as cheerleaders (women with pom-poms dancing), halftime shows (pop-stars), mega pre-game introductions (fireworks and lights) and vendors selling drinks and snacks? I stand corrected in that case.

    Oh, I'm not trying to make and excuse for them. I'm just saying that if football is clean, it's one of very, very, few sports that are. I used to think like you did - that with so many random drug tests that there's no way that they could get away with it. Then I found out that there were several types of performance enhancers that couldn't be detected through a typical urine analysis (such as human growth hormone), and that they don't do blood testing.

    I'm inclined to think that the vast majority of footballers are clean - just like the vast majority of baseball players, gridiron players, hockey players, etc., are also clean. I would think that cheaters comprise less than 5% of the players in a sport.

    Here's another thing that suprised me - most of the people who have been caught are not the best players, and don't LOOK like they were on anything. Believe it or not, most players who take steroids don't do it to look like Barry Bonds. Bonds is the poster boy for the steroid era, but he is not the typical user. Most guys on the juice do it to speed their recovery time from injury, or to lessen fatigue over the course of a long season. If everyone who did steroids looked like Bonds, it would be easy to figure out who was using and who wasn't.

    Hockey fans in Canada are jumping up and down screaming for calling hockey an American sport.

    I know you're not doing it to be insulting Barmy. And, as a sports fan, I am genuinely curioius as to how sports differ so much from place to place. For example, while I wouldn't consider myself a soccer fan, I do know the rules of the game, and I even played when I was younger. I projected what I knew about other sports to guess what professional soccer games would be like. Basically, I figured they'd by just like all the other sporting events. Evidently, I was way off in this guess.
     
  7. Barmy Army

    Barmy Army Simple mind, simple pleasures... Adored Veteran

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    No, there's no cheerleaders. Half-time consists of everyone sitting around talking about the 1st half, or checking other scores around the country, waiting for the 2nd half. No fireworks or anything before the game. Pre-match introductions are only for the big big games and that consists of players lining up for the national anthems of whatever countries. There are little shops around where you can pick up a pie or a burger or something, but their at the back somewhere out of the way. No guys coming around with trays trying to sell you crap. That's what I'm getting at with the whole commercialization of American sports. It seems to be a case where the fans sit around eating nacho's and drinking Coke, as if they're at the cinema or something.

    I mean, when I go to football. I'm stood up (not sat down, standing is conducive to big atmospheres), surrounded by mainly young men who are slightly drunk, all shouting and bawling and screaming. All intensely watching the game. It's hard to put what mean into words, but the game of football as I enjoy it is a bit more 'intense', personal and far less commercial.

    The thing is, people get caught doing in in other sports, even if only occasionally. There's a drug-taking culture around other sports, if only a little bit. Whereas I can't remember a single person getting done for drugs in football. Hell, an England international got banned for nearly a year, just because he missed a RANDOM drugs test. He didn't even know he was supposed to have one, but because they couldn't test him, he got a massive ban.

    Ah, sorry. NORTH American sports is what I mean!

    Hmm, way off in my case. I mean, the BIG events like Champions League final amd World Cups are slightly more commercial. Still not the extent of American ones though. Still no cheerleaders, big pre-match entertainments, half-time shows or anything. We don't want it in the game.

    Football matches are NOT family events. Other sports are a little more, but not football. It's really hard to break the traditions surrounded football around Europe. They've been around so long.
     
  8. Kitrax

    Kitrax Pantaloons are supposed to go where!?!?

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    Wow...I thought *soccer* was boring to begin with, but if that's how all European sports are...then count me out! It sounds like a total bore-fest. :nolike:

    I'll agree that pre-game shows are pointless, but they are good time wasters while your buddies are still showing up to the party, and they always show clips from other games that were played a few hours/days ago that you might have missed. Halftime shows are nice diversions from watching players catch their breath...and fireworks are just cool.

    BA - At this point we *all* know you don't like any sport that isn't European...and that's fine, everyone entitled to their opinion...but don't try to prove that *your* sports are better than *ours*. :nono: We like to have a good time when watching sports…and if that includes stuff blowing up, scantly clad girls shaking their chests/behinds, and the occasional good band playing during half-time, then big deal.

    The fact that the stadium where the NFL game is to be held at already sold out says *something* for American sports in Europe… :rolling:
     
  9. Barmy Army

    Barmy Army Simple mind, simple pleasures... Adored Veteran

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    Give over with yourself man.

    I explained to Aldeth why I don't like American sports, and exactly why I like the sports that I like. Wind your neck in and stop trying to find offence in everything slightly against America. I already said I wasn't slagging your sports, which you evidently didn't read before jumping in all guns blazing :almostmad: .

    Not impressive m8.
     
  10. Benan Gems: 20/31
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    The worst thing about this is that it's the 0-7 Miami Dolphins who just suck and the New York Giants who are about as fun to watch as paint drying.

    Especially when in two weeks they have the 7-0 New England Patriots and the 7-0 Indianapolis Colts featuring two of the best offenses in the NFL maybe in history (Patriots).

    If they want to expand the NFL maybe they should be promoting marquee matchups not the average sunday game.
     
  11. Aldeth the Foppish Idiot

    Aldeth the Foppish Idiot Armed with My Mallet O' Thinking Veteran

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    I can see why they start with the standard Sunday game actually. I think it makes sense to give them the average game for a couple of reasons:

    1. No one knew that the Dolphins would be 0-7 going into this game. I don't think anyone considered them to be Super Bowl contenders, but no one could have predicted that their starting quarterback and runningback were going to be out with season-ending injuries. This game was planned before the season began. It's not like they waited and then deliberately picked a bad matchup.

    2. You don't know ahead of time what game is going to be a good game regardless of which teams are playing. Sure, Pats-Colts sounds great - if you get something like the game played for last year's AFC Championship. It's not so great if you get the regular season matchup of a couple years back when the Colts won by something like 41-17. How many times have we seen a game get hyped up only to have the actual game be a snore-fest with the outcome decided before halftime?

    3. The Giant and Dolphins are two fairly popular teams. You want the game to be competitive, and I imagine the fans of England would rather see a 24-21 game than a blowout regardless of who the teams involved happened to be. Now, I'm not saying that this game will be close - all I'm saying is that since you don't know ahead of time which games will be close, picking any random game gives you as good a chance of getting a good game as picking a marquee matchup.
     
  12. Felinoid

    Felinoid Who did the what now? ★ SPS Account Holder

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    Actually, no. The NFL Europe had been running for some years now (they discontinued it to start this). Only six teams, but given that American NFL third-stringers were sent over the Atlantic to participate, I'm surprised you haven't heard of it. I was especially proud of how Craig Nall played for the Claymores a couple years ago.
     
  13. martaug Gems: 23/31
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    barmy, from your posts it seems that to you, football(soccer to us) is only for drunk men to act like fools. sorry we here in the states have just as much team spirit as you however we like to act a little bit more civilized & family friendly.
    give over with yourself.
    i am assuming that you are in your early twentys as this was how i looked at the world when i was that young & immature.(not saying you are immature just that i was at that time)
     
  14. ChickenIsGood Gems: 23/31
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    *edit*
    That is precisely why I prefer high school and college sports to professional. The atmosphere is usually electric, and you are closer to the team because they are YOUR team.

    [ October 24, 2007, 04:00: Message edited by: ChickenIsGood ]
     
  15. starfox64 Gems: 12/31
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    I'm a fan of the NFL and I catch my 3-4 games a week (including my home team). I don't agree with taking American Football overseas. Somebody has to be losing money out on this deal. And in the NFL, it's all about the money (I don't believe anybody can argue that).
    Now, if there were other teams playing in the NFL on other continents, I can see having the American teams play against them in their home countries. But showcasing games in London for the case of showcasing them is beyond me.
    It's just a fad and it'll probably go away when the money does. As for it being sold out, my opinion is that alot of it is curiousity and the rest are actual fans (also, without actually knowing ticket prices, I suspect they were probably cheaper than the average seat here in the USA to an NFL game).

    As for the second post citing NASCAR; I always said that auto racing is a sport and some drivers in some divisions can be considered athletes (all the F1 drivers I've ever seen have been in tip top physical shape). But when it comes to NASCAR and stock car racing; I consider it a sport, but I do not consider the drivers to be athletes.
     
  16. Barmy Army

    Barmy Army Simple mind, simple pleasures... Adored Veteran

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    @ martaug - That's pretty much how it is mate. You can ask anyone, they'll give you the same answer. Obviously you can find some fellas taking their girl, or their kids. But I'd bet a good 70-80% of the audience is men, mainly young. Other sports are a bit more family orientated. Like rugby is a good day out, as is cricket. Football tends not to be though. I guess that's why there's more violence around the game than other sports. LIke I said before, I thikn it's tied in with the traditions surounding the game, it's always been the same. As I say, it's hard to understand what I mean unless you've been involved in it (when I say been involved in it, I don't mean watching Premier League matches on TV, or that you once went to a game).

    @ Chicken - Exactly right m8y.
     
  17. Aldeth the Foppish Idiot

    Aldeth the Foppish Idiot Armed with My Mallet O' Thinking Veteran

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    Of course I've heard of it. If you read my first post, you'll see I even referenced NFL Europa. I never said there were no NFL Europa games played off the north american continent. (In fact, as the name implies, ALL NFL Europa games were played in Europe - Germany mostly) I said it's the first time an NFL game featuring NFL teams (as opposed to NFL Europa teams) have been played off the north american continent.

    While it is true that NFL Europa was owned by the NFL, there's a huge difference between the NFL and NFL Europa (you even pointed out some of those differences). So unless you were making a semantic point - that because NFL and NFL Europa are co-owned by the same conglomerate and because of this NFL Europa games can technically be considered NFL games - then I can't see why you'd bring it up.

    I thought that it was implicit in my previous post, but I'll say it explicitly now. This is the first time that a game featuring two of the 32 teams in the (U.S. based) NFL have played a game off of the American continent.

    I agree that the NFL is all about money, which is why I'm of the opinion that NO ONE is losing out on money. I also would dispute that the ticket prices are lower there than they would be in the U.S. In fact, I'd guess that if anything, the prices would be higher. You already pointed out that the NFL is all about money, so why would they discount the tickets?

    The only group of people who are losing out in this are the Miami Dolphins and their fans. The Dolphins are losing a home game. That means that they lose out on the tickets sales for that game and the consession sales, and Dolphin fans only get to go to 7 regular season home games instead of 8. I imagine that the NFL is compensating the Dolphins for the lost revenue from that game, and that the Dolphins in turn have refunded 1/10 of the purchase price of season tickets to their fans (when you buy NFL season tickets, you buy 10 games - 8 regular season and 2 pre-season games, all of which are priced the same). Therefore, I think it is naive to think that the NFL would do this unless they could make up that money (and even make more money) by playing this game in London. The simplest way to turn a profit by doing this would be to charge more for the tickets and/or sell more tickets. They certainly have sold MORE tickets - Dolphins stadium no way holds over 90,000 - and they probably are charging more than they otherwise would to boot.
     
  18. Harbourboy

    Harbourboy Take thy form from off my door! Veteran

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    Unlike that first LA Galaxy game that David Beckham played in. There was a 3 hour build up (mostly focusing on celebrities who were there) and it wasn't even a proper game!

    Overall, I find this intolerant attitude to other countries' sports to be fascinating.

    I'd watch any sport (if I had enough time) but I only really have time to watch Rugby Union Football and Cricket. Shame ALL my teams have had zero to celebrate in those sports this year.....
     
  19. Merlanni

    Merlanni ★ SPS Account Holder Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!)

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    A NFL team in europ is difficult. The travel and timedifference makes it unsuited to fit in the shedule. You can let teams play in their bye week, but how about the playoffs?

    I visited the Amsterdam Admirals once and was dissapointed. It just did not had it. But I like NFL and watch as much as I can. Just waiting for that Patriots and Colts battle.
     
  20. Mesmero

    Mesmero How'd an old elf get the blues?

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    I like American Football, I actually watch it more than European Football (and not only NFL, they also broadcast CFL and college football occasionally). But I really don't get why they take NFL to Europe. There will be two American teams playing an American game. People won't have a home-team to cheer for (which is probably why most people go to a game) and I doubt that the entire crowd even knows the rules. The biggest market for American Football is still the US, so you'll have a game broadcast on American television in the middle of the night or a game played at a weird time here in Europe, just to be able to broadcast it at a suitable time in the US.

    This will probably be a one time event. They will create a little fuzz around it, but American Football will never catch on in Europe. Like I said, I watch American Football probably more than the average European, but I doubt I would go see a NFL match if it was in my own country. Don't get me wrong, I would love to go to a NFL match some time, but I will do it when I visit the US, with the whole American atmosphere around it and not some forced attempt to make it big in Europe.

    Really? I didn't expect that from rugby (sorry, rugby isn't that big around here). I must definitely put that on my list if I visit the UK again.
     
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