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Keldorn's Wife

Discussion in 'BG2: Throne of Bhaal (Classic)' started by Misantrophe, May 28, 2005.

  1. Misantrophe Gems: 5/31
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    [​IMG] i dont know if this was posted before (i havent seen so i'm posting) but i found it interesting. !Spoiler!
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    i went to Keldorn's home and found out she was cheating on him. i then had Keldorn force attacked her. naturally he killed her and then without saying anything left my party and attacked me. if he was gonna attack me for it why the hell he killed his wife in the first place? he is one weird paladin if you ask me :spin:
     
  2. Goli Ironhead Gems: 16/31
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    There's possibilities more than that.You can, for example, ave Keldor put her to jail. And perhaps he was outraged, and went mad.
     
  3. Kam Gems: 15/31
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    How much of a Rep hit did you take? That's probably what set him off.
     
  4. Elwyn De'Liam Gems: 5/31
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    How can you tell a paladine to kill his wife and expect him to be ok about it? :|

    Edit: Neat, Fire Agate :eek:
     
  5. Misantrophe Gems: 5/31
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    i'm not surprised he wasnt ok about it, i'm surprised he went for it in the first place. i dont have to take his "what have i done?" c*ap.
    when you kill deep gnomes in Underdark with Jan in your party, he says sth about it like "damn you for making me do this". if Keldorn has an objection he should express it before killing his wife. i killed him by the way. that should teach him :evil:
     
  6. Western Paladin Gems: 10/31
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    What happens if you tell Keldorn to go to the authorities and turn his wife in for adultery? I've never done that.
     
  7. Benan Gems: 20/31
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    He stays in your party.

    It doesn't surprise me that he attacked you after you forced him into doing something evil. He is a paladin after all.
     
  8. The Irreligious Paladin Gems: 7/31
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    Do you people realize that you're playing a ROLE playing game in which you are expected to accept a ROLE? I mean if you want to be all creepy and force paladins to kill their cheating wives and then kill them you should at least have a Chaotic Evil character (who wouldn't have had anything to do with a paladin) or a Chaotic Neutral character whose insanity allows them to do whatever whenever. That's why I play chaotic Neutral characters most often, being crazy is fun, and you can basically play as though you have no need of "alignments" or "laws" or "people". Yea I do it. Go crazy. Aw Baby.
     
  9. LKD Gems: 31/31
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    Keldorn could kill his wife and still be on the Lawful side of things -- just the Lawful Evil side. He would be taking the law into his own hands. One of his options is to drag the guy and his wife to the courts, where they will both get the death penalty, and he seems to feel that this will not endanger his Paladin status. The advice that most people give him (forgive, forget, and spend a little quality time with the Mrs.) seems to me to be Neutral good in nature. I'd say any good character would likely give such advice, while many neutral or evil characters would either advocate killing them (LE, NE, CE, N), taking them to court (LN, LE, N), or just leaving the little slut and forgetting about her (CN, N)

    That's my take, anyhow.
     
  10. Misantrophe Gems: 5/31
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    actually i was playing according to my alignment -CG. i was just curious to see what would happen and he attacked me. i was gonna reloa but i started to hear voices in my head "kill the paladin, kill the paladin" :evil:
     
  11. Benan Gems: 20/31
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    If you were playing chaotic good, wouldn't it have made more sense to kill the guy that she's been cheating with.
     
  12. Misantrophe Gems: 5/31
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    imho if you are playing any of the good alignments you shouldnt kill anyone good unless you have to. like i said i didnt plan to kill anyone but since i already did i'll stick with evil and change my alignment in Hell. it turned out be an interesting story to kill Keldorn. anyone has an idea of a cool biography of a man who started as a goodie and became evil on the way?
     
  13. Shrikant

    Shrikant Swords! Not words! Veteran

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    Anakin Skywalker ? :tie:
     
  14. T2Bruno

    T2Bruno The only source of knowledge is experience Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Interesting. I may have a different view of alignment but:

    Good - Selfless individual. Puts the concerns and safety of others first.
    Evil - Selfish individual. Always seeks personal gain in all endeavors.

    Lawful - Puts the needs of the society before individual rights.
    Chaotic - Individual rights are paramount.

    Hence, Keldorn killing his wife is a CE act (killing an person unable to defend themselves). This act would normally cause a paladin to fall -- but since you're controlling him, it's as if you did the act. Keldorn will turn on you for any act that would normally cause a paladin to fall (as he should).

    The game has two options acceptable to Keldorn:

    LN - turn the wife in, kill the man she's seeing. She goes to prison. Family get broken up.

    CG/NG - forgive her. Family stays together.

    Personally, I always have him forgive her and allow him to stay with his family.
     
  15. Western Paladin Gems: 10/31
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    Lawful can also mean discipline (cf. Monks). Someone like a paladin has sworn to uphold virtue and justice; as such a paladin is not bound to obey a law that is unjust or evil. (This was the theme of a pen-and-paper campaign I participated in a long time ago.)

    I also have Keldorn forgive his wife. Sometimes I let him leave, but sometimes I do the "meet-up-with-him-in-three-days" act and I try to do as many crazy adventures as I can in the meantime. (One time, for example, I did Trademeet and the Planar Prison while Keldorn was with his wife.) The idea here is that we walk into the Radiant Heart covered in demon blood with a few new scars and answer "Nowhere special" when he asks what we've been up to.
     
  16. Elwyn De'Liam Gems: 5/31
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    Actually, from a classic D&D perspective, paladins must uphold the law even if it's evil...
     
  17. T2Bruno

    T2Bruno The only source of knowledge is experience Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    If you read the early (i.e. original) AD&D Players Handbook, good was paramount to the paladin. If at any time the paladin commits an evil act he or she becomes fallen and must atone for the sin. Chaotic acts, or not following the letter of the law, did not result in such severe punishments.

    The paladin was not allowed to be selfish at all. A portion of all income was automatically deducted as a tithe AND the paladin could only have a set number of magic items (no hording allowed).

    Elwyn, in your scenario, the paladin would fight AGAINST oppressive governments and unjust laws -- willing to make the ultimate sacrifice to bring the greated good to as many as possible. Of course, they might need to kill a few heretics along the way (or LOTS of giants for Norse paladins).
     
  18. Elwyn De'Liam Gems: 5/31
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    Hey, I did this quest today and ****ed it up... I don't want Keldorn to send his wife to jail! does anyone know which global variable stuff I need to change to reset the quest?
     
  19. Kitrax

    Kitrax Pantaloons are supposed to go where!?!?

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    Going a little off topic...

    How come you don't get any XP for killing Keldorn or any other NPC for that matter? You supply them with the goods, and if they turn on you, they can be quite a pain in the butt to kill...but no XP?

    Aslo, the XP you get for killing them should go up a little with each level they gain...wouldn't you agree? :rolling:
     
  20. Elwyn De'Liam Gems: 5/31
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    Since they're not supposed to be enemies, you don't get XP for killing them... just like in P&P :p
     
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