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Is this cheesy or not?

Discussion in 'BG2: Throne of Bhaal (Classic)' started by Faraaz, Apr 16, 2004.

  1. Faraaz Gems: 26/31
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    [​IMG] I've been using the following spell combination with my Sorcerer in TOB for quite some time now...check it out.

    Stoneskin-->Mislead-->Invisibility on Clone-->Project Image-->Mislead-->Invisibility on Clone-->Spell Immunity:Divination

    Once the Image runs out of spells, I do it all over again...its a bit intensive on spells, but I've found that you dont use any spells from lvls 3,5,8 which are the crucial damaging spell levels...that is, Skull Trap(way more damage at my current levels), Sunfire, Abi-Dalzim's Horrid Wilting.

    I am free to use the above mentioned spells as much as I want with this tactic, effectively gaining upto 4 or 5 times the number of spells between resting.

    I think it is a good way to maximise on your sorcerer. And since it is only using spells in a particular order, it isnt exploiting the game engine as well, as all I'm doing is casting spells...so...

    What is the verdict?

    Cheesy or not?

    PS: Its heaps more effective when you do it with the infamous Robe of vecna + Amulet of Power+Timestop+Improved Alacrity activated. :shake:
     
  2. Rednik Gems: 21/31
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    My god that is cheesy!

    I can't believe I didn't think of that. Do you use that for every battle? Or just for boss battles?

    I'm willing to bet that that will make the final ascension battle a lot easier.
     
  3. Faraaz Gems: 26/31
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    Only for boss battles. Abazigal and Sendai were a piece of cake, once I got a couple of Mordenkainen's Swords over at the doors where the Drow soldiers come in.

    How is that cheesy? Come on...that was the only way I could finish the Ascension battles and the Tactics battle on insane without a scratch...all the other ways I got hit with my own Skull Traps :p :p :p

    I'm not using Fake Talk, or SoTM or anything like that, am I?

    IMHO, its a fairly clever piece of spell casting which keeps my Sorcerer alive. :)

    Doesnt ANYONE think its legit? :(
     
  4. Mystra's Chosen Gems: 22/31
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    It's legit. Not exactly the most noble way of gaming, but each to his own.

    I never use huge combos like that because I get bored and usually just want to charge in and get chunked a couple times before I even want to haste.
     
  5. Splunge

    Splunge Bhaal’s financial advisor Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    It's cheesy to those people who think it's cheesy to use legitimate strategies to make uber-powerful characters, thereby substantially reducing the risk and challenge.

    I am not one of those people. :D

    Well done.
     
  6. Wordplay Gems: 29/31
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    "Noble" way of gaming, eh? :D

    Don't see anything wrong with it, but, IMO, only the mirror image is needed (as it gives unlimited amount of spells).

    Obviously, even the game-makers had not thought that (or otherwise they would had made some limitations to keep it balanced)
     
  7. Faraaz Gems: 26/31
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    He he...that's what happens when you solo with Sorcerers as many times as I do. The complex comboing is because I want to make it nigh impossible to hit my real self, hence making my Project Image foolproof.

    So...is it alright? And also, I had a few other strategies like that...reckon I should make an FAQ of it? D'you guys think people would be interested??
     
  8. Niskers Gems: 7/31
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    As someone who almost never uses spells like mislead....wow...gotta try that one.
     
  9. Gothmog

    Gothmog Man, a curious beast indeed! ★ SPS Account Holder Veteran

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    Oh, yes, i think a FAQ on effective spellhurler tactics would be quite appreciated. I would certainly get it :)
    I have never really gone into depth with a sorcerer or either wizard. Arcane magic in general in fact. Just the standard fireball,... offensive spells and the standard ones for protection (mirror image, stoneskin...)
    I would very much like to have an acomplished mage at hand, able to stand alone.


    As for being cheesy...
    In a way it is. The game has only so much spells memorized, and you know them all. With such a combo, you are certain nothing can breach this thus memorising no other protection spells.
    If this was Faerun in real, you certainly would not know all the spells there are. Your character certainly not, and even yourself as a player may not have known them all. So it would be quite possible for some mage who crosses your path, to have a spell that shatters such a defensive pattern up his sleeve.
    However this in a game.
    So i say it's somewhere in the middle.

    Though if i had to decide black or white, cheesy or not, i'd say not cheesy.
     
  10. Takara

    Takara My goodness! I see turnips everywhere

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    Whilst I have to say spell casting is fun in BG2, I've never been drawn out of a fighter type. However, regardless of how good it is, I've rally enjoyed the spell casting abilities of IWD2. There are more nasty spells available and are just a sheer joy to watch as bad guys helplessy plead for mercy.(Well maybe that's an exageration, but I imagine it.)
     
  11. Subra Gems: 8/31
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    Its been a long time since I been posting here.

    Is it cheesy? Let me answer your question this way...

    What would YOU do if you put yourself in your enemies place? Would you react in the same way the AI reacts to you doing it? Would any intelligent being react thus?

    Now the answer to your question should be clear.
    Exploiting inferior AI is withing the rules of course, but is it really fun for you? If so, then grats you.
     
  12. Bombur

    Bombur I'm always last and I don't like it

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    The only thing that could be considered "cheesy" by some is the use of project image, which is the most over-powered spell in the game. Some people think that using it at all is cheesy, some don't. But you have used it as it was intended to be used, so I don't see anything wrong with it. I tend to think of "cheese" as synonymous with "exploit." If it's cheesy, it's because the original spell/game is cheesy (like the infamous "cloak of cheese"), not because you have found an exploit. Now, if you start summoning more than 5 allies or more than 1 celestial ally with your projected image (projected images can summon without limitation), then you get into the area of "exploit" and might be called "cheesy." Not that it isn't fun at times, mind you. ;)

    A lesson in cheese: For those who like to rack up experience in Sendai's cave with minimal effort, head in with an invisible party that includes a good mage. Don't attack anyone -- just go eat dinner and return in a couple hours. By that time, the whole cave will be packed with little experience points. Project image --> horrid wilting (as many as you have) --> summon undead (as many as you have). You'll take out hundreds of them at a time with the wilting, and they'll never be able to see you since they can't detect invisibility. The skeletons will clean up any remnants, and take out anything else that shows up in the next 9 hours of game time. For some reason, the dwarves won't attack projected images or summoned allies. After 9 hours, you've still only "used" one spell, so you can repeat the process. If you summon a skeleton and then hit the pocket plane, you can even rest and rememorize spells without triggering the end of the dwarven spawning season. As long as the skeleton is there, the game will act as if your party were there the whole time. This isn't my typical strategy, but I have done it. Power gamers might get a kick out of it.
     
  13. david w Gems: 19/31
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    That tactic ought to win an award for cheese. :p I'm almost tempted to try it myself the next time I hit Sendai's enclave.
     
  14. Faraaz Gems: 26/31
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    Mislead as a spell has awesome potential. Usually, when you try it out once or twice and the enemy just casts a True Sight, you tend to not like it as much, and regarding it as a waste of a 6th level spell slot.

    But it has great potential to be the cheesiest spell there is. The spell combination I gave for Project Image is not the only one there is.

    A Mage/Thief wearing the Cloak of Non-Detection could use the following combo as well:

    Stoneskin-->Improved Haste-->Mislead-->Have the clone Hide in Shadows-->Spell Immunity:Divination-->Tenser's Transformation

    Do this with Jan and try backstabbing...should have interesting results :grin:

    A Sorcerer with the Staff of the Magi equipped could double his effectiveness. For example, the long convoluted list of spells is not required, as a simple Spell Immunity:Divination, followed by equipping the Staff gives the same results. Do this with your Image clone...it works!!

    Also, casting Improved Alacrity while behind the cover of a Spell Immunity guarantees that you will get it off. After every spell is cast, re-equipping the staff will keep you undercover, effectively making a mockery of the enemy mages in the game. It is not a limitation of the enemy AI if you do that. They just can't do anything short of a mysterious Godlike force(DM :p ) reaching in and wrenching the Staff out of my Sorc's hands. :shake:
     
  15. Deathbringer Gems: 2/31
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    [​IMG] I have done that xp harvesting trick before in Sendai's Cave but it's much more profitable and useful to do way sooner. Like when you get the robe of cheese kill all the shark ppl in sharkville and leave only the two priests. They will keep hitting you with magic which does nothing and raising dead that you can easily obliterate. Either by guarding the area or by turning undead. But what's the point in doing this? If you hit your xp cap the game isn't any more fun. No more leveling up to look forward to.
     
  16. Faraaz Gems: 26/31
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    Yes...but you get to destroy legions upon legions of mere mortals...BWAHAHAHAHAHA!! :evil: :evil: Fear ME!!! :evil: :evil:

    Um...yeah... :wave:
     
  17. Bombur

    Bombur I'm always last and I don't like it

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    Unless you're a powergamer. And you'll note that I classified this tactic as "cheese."
     
  18. Elendrile Gems: 5/31
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    If you want infinite XP, there's no reason to wait till Sendai's lair. It's quite easy to kill Fire Giant after Fire Giant with just a bow from the tops of city walls. Just slap on a Ring of Gaxx and Ring of Regeneration in case you get hit by one og the fireballs.
     
  19. Sparhawk the Pandion Gems: 14/31
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    Except the fireballs never hit there, at least not for me.
     
  20. Bombur

    Bombur I'm always last and I don't like it

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    In my case there is a reason -- I can't even see the fire giants from the wall, let alone shoot one with an arrow. I've heard of people doing this, but for the life of me I can't figure out why their game is so different from mine.
     
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