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Gangraped and murdered

Discussion in 'Alley of Lingering Sighs' started by Cúchulainn, Feb 22, 2007.

  1. Carcaroth

    Carcaroth I call on the priests, saints and dancin' girls ★ SPS Account Holder

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    Cuch,

    Agreed, but they wouldn't have faced the death penalty in any of the European countries, or in the majority of US states. It's a particularly emotive crime, but I still don't want the death penalty available in the UK, and would applaud it's removal in the US. These people are never going to see freedom again, and that is good enough for me.
     
  2. Iku-Turso Gems: 26/31
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    You might want to check out my previous message, I did some hefty editing...

    I'm pretty much on the same line with all of you people. That being said, what I hate even more than bad decisions of the court is bad politics.
     
  3. Aldeth the Foppish Idiot

    Aldeth the Foppish Idiot Armed with My Mallet O' Thinking Veteran

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    It has nothing (or at least very little) to do with publicity. The two people at this point who have been tried and sentences plead guilty, and are cooperating with the investigation. It is common in cases that if you plead guilty, and help the authorities with the prosecution of the others involved, that you get a relatively lighter sentence. The trigger man (all were involved in the rape, but from what I understand it was Green who was the the person who executed the girl and her family), has yet to be tried, and he very well may get the death penalty.
     
  4. Iku-Turso Gems: 26/31
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    Oh...right...That was in the article, and brought up in this discussion as well...

    So...towed by my emotions again and jumping into conlusions...eh... :rolleyes:

    What an awful mess they're having in Iraq. What an awful mess you get when you go to war. What a shame. A crying shame. Sh** A lot of times anger is an emotional defence. Now that my anger subsides, I feel just terrible by all this. Awful. Just awful.
     
  5. T2Bruno

    T2Bruno The only source of knowledge is experience Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Rape and murder happens on a daily basis in CHICAGO (hourly throughout the US). Those cases rarely make the news -- just why would a rape and murder in another country be any different?

    People are reading too much into the apathy of the American public. The apathy has nothing to do with PR, nothing to do with Iraq, nothing to do with 9/11. The American public is desensitized to violent crime. Violent crime is fact of life in America -- it's part of our entertainment and part of our daily lives (for those of us living in a big city).

    Only the sensational crimes (often called Hollywood crimes) remain in the public eye for more than a soundbite on a newscast. And sensational has more to do with the fame of the victim or flambouyance of the criminal than the nature of the crime. In fact, the more horrific the crime, the quicker it disappears from the news.

    It sounds like the prosecuters are doing everything right in this case. Blame the lack of press on the apathy of the American public toward violence. Blame the apathy on whoever you want (gaming industry, movie industry, parents -- but do not ever blame the individual).
     
  6. The Great Snook Gems: 31/31
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    I fail to see what this has to do with the topic (or anything else for that matter). Justice was served. What more can we expect from the courts?

    Are we supposed to expect the courts to be a referendum on the executive branch's foreign policy? Maybe under other systems of government the courts are run by the government, but in ours the judicial branch is a seperate entity.
     
  7. Nakia

    Nakia The night is mine Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    I agree with T@Bruno. Having lived for over 25 years in NYC we hear to much, see to much have to much happen to us to go in to rage over something that happen thousands of miles from us. We shake our heads say something to effect of "That's terrible. And then go to talk about what a similar thing that happened to cousin Elsie and her family.

    When you live with violence as part of life you do get desensitized to it. That does not mean you think it is right or justified but we aren't going to go into hysterics over it especially just to keep the rest of the world happy.

    Some people would criticize us no matter what we said or did. Its part of the "Let's all gang up on what we perceive as the Big Bully" syndrome.
     
  8. Abomination Gems: 26/31
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    The difference I see is that these are soldiers of the United States who are raping the very population they're trying to protect. I understand that America (New York especially) is a violent place but those soldiers need to be made a stern example of -- that this type of behaviour by those in power or responsibility will not be tolerated in the least.

    The reason for me thinking they should be killed has nothing to do with the fact that they're American but the fact that they're soldiers and should damn well act like it.
     
  9. Nakia

    Nakia The night is mine Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    Please read Aldeth's post for why the two men did not get the death penalty. The 'cooperated' with the authorities. In order to get that cooperation they would be promised a lesser sentence. A life sentence is nothing to be sneezed at. No freedom for the rest of your life.
     
  10. Barmy Army

    Barmy Army Simple mind, simple pleasures... Adored Veteran

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    That's not really true though, is it?
     
  11. Daie d'Malkin

    Daie d'Malkin Shoulda gone to Specsavers

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    25 years isn;t the rest of your life. Not by a long shot.
     
  12. Argohir Gems: 10/31
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    They should be ****ed to the death, until their organs come apart. I want to insert tnt to their *******s and blow them up.
    But to be realistic, they should be executed. The punishment have to be so heavy that it would prevent everybody from daring to do it in the future.
     
  13. Ilmater's Suffering Gems: 21/31
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    90 years however is longer then the average life expectancy for men in the United States. This guy won't be seeing the world outside of the prison walls ever again. Assuming our convict is in his 20s, he can't get out until he's in his 110s.

    Life in prison or death penalty, either way it's a life wasted. Not to mention it always takes years anyway for those on death row to be executed as they usually get to exhaust the appeals system before they're executed.
     
  14. Abomination Gems: 26/31
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    So rather than off-them in a military court that are surprisingly cheap compared to normal courts we're going to pay for their food and board for the rest of their lives... and other associated costs such as prison guard wages etc.

    Or we could line them up against a wall and shoot them all for the cost of a few bullets and maybe some wear and tear on some guns.
     
  15. Barmy Army

    Barmy Army Simple mind, simple pleasures... Adored Veteran

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    Death is preferable as it happens to be cheaper. What a wonderful world we live in.
     
  16. Enagonios Gems: 31/31
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    For people like this I waver between life in prison and the death penalty. I'm generally pro-"whatever will maximize their suffering". If they look like they "don't have what it takes" to last in prison, I'd send them there, make them suffer and be the jailhouse bi+ch so that they'll want to off themselves. But if they have enough money, influence or whatever it takes to get pretty comfy in prison, do an old-school russian execution on them. Stick them in a room with a drain and clip them behind the ear, cheapest execution and save the taxpayers' money.
     
  17. Dendri Gems: 20/31
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    I dont care about what happens to these monsters. What is done to them is utterly trivial. Kill them, make their lifes miserable - it makes no difference in my mind. It's all simply a shallow semblance of justice.

    I just care for that unfortunate child. Wherever we are traveling after our bodies died - if we are traveling anywhere in death - I hope the poor thing finds a measure of peace and healing. :(
     
  18. The Shaman Gems: 28/31
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    @T2Bruno: The difference is that the people were not expected to act like thugs from the local barrio. Soldiers are expected to be disciplined and usually upstanding members of their societies. While it's not always the case (I read once that in Japan the regions near military bases have a notably high number of rapes), this case was a lot more heartless than the average rape.

    The worst part is that these people could have been normal young men 2-3 years back, but just lacked the stable mind not to lose their integrity in such a way. Even a 25-year sentence is nothing to sneer at. They're losing the best years of their life, and it's not like they will fit in perfectly even after/if they get out alive.

    More uncounted casualties of war. Huzzah for the vision of a New Middle East.
     
  19. Goli Ironhead Gems: 16/31
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    I'll wager that the bastard is in for a world of pain when he gets to the jail. I've heard, many times, of beatings of child rapists and murderers by other prisoners. And I can only hope that it will happen now.
     
  20. T2Bruno

    T2Bruno The only source of knowledge is experience Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    There are a lot of people on these boards that have a very mistaken view of who comprises the military throughout the world.

    In most areas of the world (the US included) the enlisted member of the military come from a wide sampling of the entire countries populace -- that includes the criminal section. Generally, the enlisted members of the US military come from middle class or lower class backgrounds (the officers are predominantly from middle class). In fact, during time of conflict many recruiters will accept anyone just to meet their monthly quota. There is no magic test which will weed the criminal mind from the military.

    When I first entered the military many of my friends insulted me and told me how disappointed they were in my decision. In Dear Abby today in my paper was a mother who was deeply disturbed that her children would think of joining the military -- and Abby agreed with her. A huge section of the US believes there is no honor in serving their country -- upstanding members of society? I wish.

    Discipline is taught in the military, but is not a requirement for joining the military. For far too many in the military, discipline is a trait used only when supervisors are watching.

    These men hung out together because they were drawn together -- violent men with common interests in hurting others. They are fortunately a minority in the military. But even as a minority this class of miscreants can do tremendous damage. What you have here is a group of thugs who used their authority for personal gain and enjoyment. I agree they should all be put to death, but it's just not that easy to do.
     
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