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Covid-19 Restrictions

Discussion in 'Alley of Dangerous Angles' started by Sorvo, Apr 28, 2020.

  1. Taluntain

    Taluntain Resident Alpha and Omega Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    Do you also believe that the government and private businesses should be allowed to make their own decisions on whether they want to employ people who are not vaccinated?
     
  2. Sorvo

    Sorvo Where's the nearest pub? Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Veteran

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    Never had the flu shot and can't remember the last time was sick from it, must be all the :beer: They will have to hold a gun to my head to take the COVID shot! This shit is getting ridiculous :beer:
     
  3. Blades of Vanatar

    Blades of Vanatar Vanatar will rise again Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    I to am a big proponent of if you drink enough alcohol it should kill all bacteria. At least it should be enjoyable trying to prove the theory accurate.
     
  4. Blades of Vanatar

    Blades of Vanatar Vanatar will rise again Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Of course one can get the flu after a flu shot as the flu has new strands every year. The shot only covers what the medical industry think they know are the active strands. It mutates constantly. They will never be ahead of the game.
     
  5. Blackthorne TA

    Blackthorne TA Master in his Own Mind Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Sure. I do not believe the government should be allowed to pressure private businesses to do their bidding though, especially through OSHA. Which is just as ridiculous as the CDC mandating an eviction moratorium; glad that was finally rejected.

    But really, why the fear of the unvaccinated? Unvaccinated does not mean you are riddled with SARS-Cov-2. And vaccinated apparently does not mean you are not. Everyone has the choice to get vaccinated if they want to at this point, so let the unvaccinated take their chances and let the vaccinated be secure in their choice and protection.
     
  6. Tarrasque

    Tarrasque Whoever said Paladins had to be charismatic? ★ SPS Account Holder Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Problem is that the unvaccinated suddenly don’t like taking their chances when they actually become ill enough to need hospital treatment.

    Then means they take up the space of someone vaccinated that needs treatment for an unrelated condition.
     
  7. Taluntain

    Taluntain Resident Alpha and Omega Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    Realistically, I have a higher chance of contracting covid from an unvaccinated person than from one who is vaccinated. And the unvaccinated have a considerably higher chance of suffering negative side effects to their health from catching covid than from any of the vaccines on the market. So a similar question "why the fear of vaccines?" could be posed to those who don't want to get vaccinated.

    The choice isn't really as clear-cut as you make it out to be. The latest research suggests that the vaccines are only 60-66% effective against the delta variant, which is now predominant here. My getting vaccinated is only the last line of defence against covid, but definitely not something that I want to test if I can possibly avoid it.

    So the unvaccinated aren't only gambling with their health, but also with the health of anyone else that they come in close contact with, especially in enclosed spaces such as work environments, family gatherings and so on. Add to that the fact that in my experience the majority of those who don't want to get vaccinated also don't want to wear masks or wear them in such a way as to render them ineffective, which significantly increases their chances of infecting others once they become infected themselves.
     
  8. Blackthorne TA

    Blackthorne TA Master in his Own Mind Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    Who says someone who takes their chances should not get treatment if they have a negative outcome? You could say that about a whole lot of things if you want to go down that road.

    That is unknowable since "unvaccinated" at least here in the US includes those who have caught the disease and recovered. And since vaccinated people as you point out are not necessarily immune and can spread the disease, you cannot trust that anyone you come into contact with is not contagious. It's also unclear as far as I'm aware (conflicting info) how contagious asymptomatic/presymptomatic people are.

    So. Take care of yourself as you see fit and let other people take care of themselves as they see fit.

    I'd say because it is new technology, and there is a vast history of released drugs that have later been determined to be very harmful.
     
    Blades of Vanatar likes this.
  9. Taluntain

    Taluntain Resident Alpha and Omega Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    Whereas covid is a new virus and already has been determined to be potentially very harmful, causing everything from lasting long-term negative effects to death. In exponentially higher numbers than the vaccines. The irony of some people being more frightened of the vaccines which so far have been proven to be infinitely safer than catching covid is really quite striking.
     
  10. dmc

    dmc Speak softly and carry a big briefcase Staff Member Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!)

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    Well, at least in the US, we have a long history of vaccine denial/suspicion that goes back well over a century. There are always people who feel that their personal rights are more important than the overall health and safety of the population. However, we have an equally long history of those people being told to shove it. The problem right now is that there is not a tremendous amount of political will to do what is necessary to mandate vaccines across the board. That allows for all sorts of weasel ways out like "religious exemptions" even though not a single major religion says a damned thing against vaccines.

    Also, we now have Republican legislatures and governors in many states who are more concerned with appeasing the wackos and Trump than in actually safeguarding the public good. So you get idiots like Abbot and De Santis who are pushing against all sorts of mandates, whether vaccine or masks or anything like that. It's so logically inconsistent with all of their other positions that it would be comical if it weren't so dangerous.

    And the old canard that we don't know what the long term side effects might be is nonsense. At no time previously when vaccine mandates were enforced for new vaccines had we any idea what the long terms effects would be, but we mandated them anyway, for the betterment of the whole society.
     
  11. Taluntain

    Taluntain Resident Alpha and Omega Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    Oh, it's no better here, really. We have a good 40% of the population with moderate to extremely strong anti-vaccine sentiments. But the saddest thing is, most of it is not due to any bad past experiences with vaccines but simply due to the influence of lies and misinformation spread over Facebook that people choose to believe over the words of medical professionals. Everything from vaccines causing autism, to Bill Gates wanting to implant them with chips, to there being various poisonous substances in the vaccines, to covid not existing, to the pandemic being a global conspiracy and that all the medical professionals are paid off to lie about covid, to everyone infected daring to speak about covid is a paid actor, etc. etc. The endless stream of crazy that this huge chunk of population takes for granted is mind-boggling.

    From what I've seen, FB is usually the only source of information for these people, or at least the only one that they trust, so manipulating this huge mob is very easy as they feed themselves and perpetuate a constant stream of made up BS that only reinforces their beliefs. No amount of reasoning, common sense, persuasion or disproving their claims has any chance whatsover to sway their opinion. They simply dismiss everything that goes against their beliefs as lies.
     
  12. SlickRCBD Gems: 25/31
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    I used to get the flu almost every year growing up, so as soon as the flu shots were available to me in '97 I got one. I know that they had limited availability in '96 and my mother was able to get one through the school she worked for, but I asked my doctor and pharmacist and neither knew how to get one.
    I didn't get the flu again until February of 2019, and was shocked since I had had a flu shot around Halloween 2018 and had gotten one around that time every year except for the year with the H1N1 scare when there were shortages and I couldn't get one until early December (not from a lack of trying).
    I'm shocked that is on a CDC site.
    I've felt "under the weather" with extreme lethargy, occasionally a slight fever, and absolutely no energy a few times after getting a flu shot. I was convinced I was getting sick.
    Sometimes a sore throat and/or runny nose. It varies over the last 23 years. It never lasts more than 3 days.
    Usually I've only had a little soreness and minor swelling of the arm for a day or two.
    A few times I've not had any symptoms at all.
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2021
  13. SlickRCBD Gems: 25/31
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    I might have found the eviction moratorium less stupid if they had instead allowed things like wage & income garnishments and confiscation of assets for the people who could not be evicted.
    Yes, some of the really poor wouldn't have been able to pay anything, but plenty of people took advantage of it and abused the system.
    Probably only a fraction of the people who were helped by it, but they could have done some kind of public assistance thing instead (granted, the States were broke with unemployment claims while tax revenues were down because of all the stores being closed, but the landlords had bills to pay as well.)
     
  14. Blackthorne TA

    Blackthorne TA Master in his Own Mind Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!)

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    I take it from the rest of the post you are shocked that the CDC says you cannot catch the flu from a flu shot? What you described as the symptoms you felt after shots is your body's immune response to the vaccine which is what makes you immune to the actual flu strains they included in the vaccine. I'd imagine that when you had hardly any reaction to the vaccine you were probably already resistant/immune to those strains.

    Flu vaccines do not have any live virus in them.

    IIRC my mother told me I nearly died of rubella from the MMR vaccine, so the doctors were fairly certain I would have died from it if I had actually caught the fully viable virus instead of the attenuated one in the vaccine.
     
  15. dmc

    dmc Speak softly and carry a big briefcase Staff Member Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!)

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  16. Taluntain

    Taluntain Resident Alpha and Omega Staff Member ★ SPS Account Holder Resourceful Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) New Server Contributor [2012] (for helping Sorcerer's Place lease a new, more powerful server!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    Many lower level school teachers and nurses are some of the more vocal anti-vaxxers and spreaders of covid/vaccine misinformation here. Just goes to show that education by itself has never stopped anyone from being stupid. But it's the same with most people who spend half of their days on Facebook, really. Social media spreads lies and misinformation like the plague.
     
  17. yasoooo Banned

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    Is Coronavirus COVID 19 a Punishment from Allaah? - ...

     
  18. SlickRCBD Gems: 25/31
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    I just spent over three months working on upgrading Amita hospital computers. They had some web seminars in both June and July that were open to everyone on COVID vaccinations. Also being vaccinated was required for me to get the job.

    Even so, I should note that at one point a computer broke in the critical care center (modern name for the ICU) that was on The List to be replaced in a room with a COVID patient and they had me in a full "bunny suit" to do the replacement even though I was vaccinated.
    Although part of it was to protect everyone else as I was sure to get the virus on the bunny suit and they had me put it in a bio-hazard bin when I came out.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2021
  19. SlickRCBD Gems: 25/31
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    Just had a thought. The banks have been pushing these new "tappable" credit and debit cards in response to COVID so you don't have to touch the pinpad. Seems we just switched to the chip reader cards, as I only got the chips the last time my cards expired. Now my cards expired again last summer and my banks sent the new "tappable" "contactless" cards as replacements. I suppose it makes sense for credit cards, but the "tappable" debit cards still need you to enter your PIN on the pinpad.
    Doesn't that kinda defeat the purpose of not having to touch the pinpad? What's the point?
     
  20. Sorvo

    Sorvo Where's the nearest pub? Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Veteran

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    I just found out today my coworker is out with covid,. I was working with him yesterday but I feel fine. I chalk it up to my consumption intake :beer:
     
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