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Age of Main Character problem.

Discussion in 'Baldur's Gate (Classic)' started by Nakia, Jul 8, 2005.

  1. Nakia

    Nakia The night is mine Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    There has been a bit of discussion on the board regarding the age of the Main Character. (I don't like CharName so will use PC henceforth)

    It seems the PC is 20 yrs old or there abouts. This bothers me because in a Medieval type society he or she would be considered an adult by 14 or 15.

    hum..maybe the PC is a half-elf. That would make more sense to me. A 20 yr old half-elf would still be a child.

    Any thoughts or suggestions?
     
  2. Undertaker Gems: 27/31
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    If 20 yr old half-elf is considered a child that 20 yr old elf would still be considered as baby.
    And think about other Bhaalspawsn as well (dragons and giants) - I don't know when those races reach maturity but not at age of 20
     
  3. Felinoid

    Felinoid Who did the what now? ★ SPS Account Holder

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    2nd ed. starting ages are as follows:

    Human: 16-19
    Half-elf: 16-21
    Halfling: 23-32
    Dwarf: 45-70
    Gnome: 63-96
    Elf: 105-130

    I think human can be explained as excessive sheltering by Gorion, and half-elf fits perfectly. A young halfling is easily explainable by matters coming to a head before they're really ready. A 20-year old dwarf is a bit of a stretch, and gnomes & full-blooded elves are just plain silly.
     
  4. Nakia

    Nakia The night is mine Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    Thanks Felinoid. I am still uncomfortable with human. It is true that Gorion kept PC sheltered but he (Gorion) knew that the PC would have to face his blood sometime. Seems to me a human would have more training probably in both fighting and magic.

    From various dialogue I don't think the developers expected anyone to play a halfling.

    So half-elf seems to be the best. I usually play a half-elf. :happy:
     
  5. Pseudospawn Gems: 8/31
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    I'm not 100% with the story, but was the 'Time of Troubles' only a few days/months/years?

    Gorion went to Candlekeep for safety and to research the prophecies. We have no idea when he learned the true nature of the PC, although i would bet it was a short while before the events of BGI.
     
  6. Nakia

    Nakia The night is mine Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    'Time of Troubles' was about 20 yrs before BG I starts which is why the age of the PC is put at 18-20. How long it lasted I don't know.

    Later evidence indicates to me that Gorion knew PC's bloodline. Enough said about that. :)
     
  7. Pseudospawn Gems: 8/31
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    @Nakia, are you familiar with the term 'no duh' :p
    The later evidence (BGII TOB) still is vague about when Gorion learned of the PC's heritage. It could have been from procuring the PC or from noticing the birthmark. Or more likely when he noticed another young man named Sarevok with similar markings resarching the prophecies.

    The point i was trying to make is that the time of troubles couldnt have been a short period of time considering Bhaal travelled the length of the land impregnating as many as possible. That many people takes time. Also likely he did some reproducing before being made flesh which would explain any children of Bhaal older than 20.

    Making it fair for the PC to be any race. besides if youre creative enough you can argue the likelihood of being that race. Bhaal's blood maturing the PC faster, soemthign like that.
     
  8. Felinoid

    Felinoid Who did the what now? ★ SPS Account Holder

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    @Pseudospawn:
    Yes, but I doubt Bhaal would have known about it eighty years before it happened. And if Bhaal's blood aged faster, the PC would die of old age sooner too, which is hardly an advantage.

    That being said, I think the creators of the game were wrong to give the PC a set age no matter what your race was, even though it's necessary to the plot. So I just ignore it and play an elf anyway. :D
     
  9. MrNexx Gems: 7/31
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    The Time of Troubles was 1358; I didn't think the game took place as late as 1378, did it? That's beyond where the PnP game is, even now.

    However, nothing in BG1 says that you were born with the ToT... you might have been born 20 years before the game started, and your innate power only starts coming forward because Bhaal's power got fused into the Realms with his death.
     
  10. Jesper898 Gems: 21/31
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    It doesn't mean that an elf, for example, would look like a baby for 100 years. He/she would still look "adult" at 20 years, or so, even though he/she would still be considered a very young elf.
     
  11. MrNexx Gems: 7/31
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    Not in 2nd edition, Jesper. They put that in with 3e (and it does make a bit more sense), but in 2nd edition elves were children until about 75, and adolesence lasted until you were about 110.
     
  12. Shrikant

    Shrikant Swords! Not words! Veteran

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    Bhall walked the mortal lands spreading his spawn before the time of troubles. It does not matter when the BG saga starts in relation to that time then.
    It is no where mentioned how long before the time of troubles it was the Bhall realised his impending doom. So it is entirely possible that Bhallspawn range from Dragon kin to humans.

    The only indication of the PC's age that we have is Imoen saying that they grew up together. The PC does not refute her statement, ever. Since she is a human, the PC too must be of similar age as her.

    The other fact is that Gorion rescued the PC from being sacrificed. Again it is unknown if Imoen was also brought in around that time.
    However Gorian too is human. And since he was allowed to adopt the PC, he could not possibly have been younger than 25-40 years old at that time. Gorion could not be older than 50-55 years at the time of his death. This gives us the possible age range of PC as 15-30 years.

    By Felinoid's description only humans, halflings, halfelves and halforc fall in this range. (Dont give me the halforcs are not allowed in BG I excuse. They are allowed in BG II and that should be enough.)

    If PC was a child at the time of his rescue by Gorion, the definition could be stretched to include dwares. However Gnomes and Elfs are still out of the question imo.
     
  13. Chevalier Mal Fet Gems: 13/31
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    Well, I haven't ever read all the novels based on the time of troubles, but the ones I have read seem to indicate that it didn't even last so much as a year.

    The key bit of info, I don't recall where I read this, was that Bhaal foresaw his own death. It never says when he was tipped off, but he is/was a god, so I'd imagine it would be possible to gain this insight pretty early.

    And besides, who says that the elder races have the same standards for coming of age? As far as I am concerned an elf at 20 could look just as old as a human at 16 but be considered far, far less mature by their own culture.

    Where in any rule book does it cover these specifics? I know elves generally don't adventure til they come of age at 100, but these are extraordinary circumstances.
     
  14. Felinoid

    Felinoid Who did the what now? ★ SPS Account Holder

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    Update from The Complete Book of Humanoids:
    Half-Orc starting age: 13-16

    Wow, that's young. Personally, I don't think Gorion could have held a half-orc back that long, and I doubt that Bhaal would have found an orc or half-orc terribly attractive. :shake:
     
  15. Chevalier Mal Fet Gems: 13/31
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    Do you think a god of murder would find an elf any more attractive? Or a gnome or a halfling?
    I think you're projecting.

    I stand by my extraordinary circumstances statement.
     
  16. MrNexx Gems: 7/31
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    Complete Book of Elves gives the breakdown of elven age categories.
     
  17. Nakia

    Nakia The night is mine Distinguished Member ★ SPS Account Holder Adored Veteran Pillars of Eternity SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) Torment: Tides of Numenera SP Immortalizer (for helping immortalize Sorcerer's Place in the game!) BoM XenForo Migration Contributor [2015] (for helping support the migration to new forum software!)

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    I just checked the Bio in BGI for my PC. It does not say how long he lived in Candlekeep. Imoen came 10 years later and has a comparative age to him/her.

    When Xzar first meets her he refers to her as a child. Now this is only a game but one I take seriously in a fun way. So to me the PC would be under 16 human years of age in BGI. That is just my feeling.
     
  18. Felinoid

    Felinoid Who did the what now? ★ SPS Account Holder

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    @Chevalier Mal Fet:
    Very true. I withdraw my comment.
    I still think that a half-orc would try to break out on his own early, though.

    @MrNexx:
    For those who do not have the CBoE:
    Subrace . . . Adolescence . . . Adulthood . . . Middle Age (when stat changes start)
    Aquatic . . . 60 . . . 100 . . . 160
    Drow . . . 50 . . . 80 . . . 140
    Grey . . . 80 . . . 120 . . . 210
    High . . . 75 . . . 110 . . . 175
    Sylvan . . . 70 . . . 105 . . . 170

    So, as you can see, even the relatively short-lived drow are mere children until their 50th year. High elves (the subrace that most elves are assumed to be) are children until they're 75, which translates to about 13 or 14 for a human. (Definitely Lvl 0 material.)

    @Nakia:
    I like the comparative age angle. It manages to sweep age under the rug. It doesn't explain DoB, though.
     
  19. Dall Gems: 3/31
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    Mr.Nexx, how would you then explain that Drizzt in the dark Elf trilogy, which as far as I know, is a grown-up when he is 40? As far as I remember the book was written before 3rd edition, but maybe I'm wrong... Or is it different with drow? Do they become adults quicker than their surface cousins?
     
  20. MrNexx Gems: 7/31
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    My old DM apparently met RA Salvatore at a con one year, and was told he put something blatantly wrong in every book, just to make sure no one could point to them as canon. Given the age range which Felinoid quoted, I can only assume that was part of it.

    I'll freely admit that the age categories for elves in 2nd edition were somewhat non-sensical... but they were the ones written down, which made the game somewhat jarring with an elven PC.
     
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